Evergreen ILS Website

IRC log for #evergreen, 2023-06-13

| Channels | #evergreen index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary | Join Webchat

All times shown according to the server's local time.

Time Nick Message
04:00 sleary joined #evergreen
06:25 sleary joined #evergreen
07:40 collum joined #evergreen
07:44 rfrasur joined #evergreen
08:02 BDorsey joined #evergreen
08:24 sleary joined #evergreen
08:33 mmorgan joined #evergreen
08:49 jvwoolf joined #evergreen
08:50 jvwoolf joined #evergreen
08:54 dguarrac joined #evergreen
08:57 Stompro joined #evergreen
09:07 Dyrcona joined #evergreen
09:09 Christineb joined #evergreen
09:23 mantis1 joined #evergreen
09:24 mantis1 Found this error when running autoreconf -i for our 3.11.0 test server install
09:24 mantis1 autoreconf: automake failed with exit status: 1
09:24 mantis1 I think this was related to a makefile when I saw it before, but it's been some time
09:32 gmcharlt mantis1: what Linux distribution?
09:40 pinesol News from commits: LP2019735 Fix Bootstrap5 checkbox borders <https://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=E​vergreen.git;a=commitdiff;h=e62173​478e9e509f3f8c225b4ea262e0ffb18dfa>
09:41 mantis1 gmcharlt: I figured it out
09:41 mantis1 it was something I needed to do in .gitignore first
09:41 gmcharlt ah
09:41 gmcharlt local to your setup, I take it?
09:59 sleary joined #evergreen
10:03 mantis1 I believe so
10:03 mantis1 though I did run into this error when running sudo make -f Open-ILS/src/extras/Makefile.install ubuntu-focal-developer
10:03 mantis1 https://pastebin.com/c8TwRCYP
10:03 mantis1 We think it's something to do with node.js
10:03 mantis1 not sure if it's community affected or just our local setup
10:05 Dyrcona I'm not a Node expert, but have you installed Node on this system before? If so, did you remove the previous Node installation beforehand?
10:08 mantis1 Dyrcona: I'll check with another staff member
10:10 mantis1 Yes we have
10:11 pinesol News from commits: LP#1996818 Issues Placing Holds from the Patron Record <https://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=E​vergreen.git;a=commitdiff;h=db037c​5129182c2d816b511fbf8a9a0c6b492279>
10:11 pinesol News from commits: LP#1996818 Issues Placing Holds from the Patron Record <https://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=E​vergreen.git;a=commitdiff;h=2a2af7​843d2db0440ffb3b0fe4c59e3157af35f9>
10:11 Dyrcona That might have been the problem. Whenever you do a major version upgrade of Evergreen, it's best to delete the node files in /usr/local/ and to do a `git clean -x -f -d` in your local Evergreen repository to remove any old files.
10:14 mantis1 Dyrcona: I have the code prep and scripts done.  Is it possible to run these now or does it need to be done at a specific time during the code prep?
10:16 Dyrcona mantis1: They should be done before you do anything else. You will probably be OK, because we don't change Node versions that often. I do the git clean -x -f -d from time to time to clean things up on my dev systems particularly if I'm switching release versions or about to test big changes,
10:18 Dyrcona I've had weird issues after doing an installation that going back and doing the node deletion or a git clean and reinstalling has fixed.
10:54 Dyrcona @blame Apple
10:54 pinesol Dyrcona: Apple is really just another name for autogen
10:55 Dyrcona pinesol: No, that's too generous.
10:55 pinesol Dyrcona: What we have here is a failure to communicate.
10:55 Dyrcona pinesol: Indeed we do, but the failure is yours.
10:55 pinesol Dyrcona: it's origin/main all the way down
10:55 Dyrcona @blame pinesol
10:55 pinesol Dyrcona: It really IS itself's fault!
10:55 Dyrcona :)
10:56 Dyrcona @praise pinesol
10:56 * pinesol <cameron_voice>itself you're Dyrcona's HERO</cameron_voice>
11:00 Dyrcona @dunno 22
11:00 pinesol Dyrcona: uh huh.. please tell me more about that
11:00 Dyrcona @dunno get 22
11:00 pinesol Dyrcona: Dunno #22: "Yeah, well, you know, that's just like uh, your opinion, man." (added by csharp at 11:31 AM, November 11, 2013)
11:35 jihpringle joined #evergreen
12:02 Dyrcona eeevil: When I said 'it is fine to use "IF NOT EXISTS" with all of the appropriate  commands, i.e. all that offer it as an option,' I wasn't thinking of functions. I should have added that caveat.
12:04 Dyrcona I'm starting to think, though, if using "if not exists" might be a bad idea. Someone could have added a custom field or index that is incompatible with the default one that Evergreen is trying to add, and they should get notified of that.
12:10 javier_guel joined #evergreen
12:11 javier_guel Hi all, I am in process to configure our new EG server with the 3.11.0 version, I am trying to config the actions triggers, Could someone showme what line to add to cron job?
12:17 Dyrcona javier_guel: There are multiple lines in the Open-ILS/examples/crontab.example file to run the action triggers.
12:18 Dyrcona They all run action_trigger_runner.pl.
12:25 javier_guel so, the action triggers are writen in 3.11v as in the 3.4v?
12:41 Dyrcona javier_guel: Yes. Running them has not changed.
12:47 rfrasur joined #evergreen
12:52 javier_guel Dyrcona tks
12:56 Stompro gmcharlt++, thanks for the new release for the 3.10.1-3.10.2 upgrade script issue.
12:58 * Dyrcona shall return.
13:04 sleary joined #evergreen
14:33 tslittle joined #evergreen
14:35 terranm joined #evergreen
14:45 Bmagic dev meeting in 15 minutes
14:46 shulabear joined #evergreen
14:49 Dyrcona joined #evergreen
14:55 collum joined #evergreen
14:56 shulabear joined #evergreen
15:00 Bmagic #startmeeting 2023-06-13 - Developer Meeting
15:00 pinesol Meeting started Tue Jun 13 15:00:02 2023 US/Eastern.  The chair is Bmagic. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
15:00 pinesol Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
15:00 pinesol The meeting name has been set to '2023_06_13___developer_meeting'
15:00 Bmagic #info Agenda at https://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/do​ku.php?id=dev:meetings:2023-06-13
15:00 Bmagic #topic Introductions
15:00 terranm #info terranm is Terran McCanna, PINES
15:00 Bmagic #info Bmagic = Blake GH, MOBIUS
15:01 smorrison joined #evergreen
15:01 shulabear #info shulabear is Shula Link, PINES
15:01 Stompro #info Stompro = Josh Stompro, LARL
15:01 sleary #info sleary = Stephanie Leary, Equinox
15:01 Dyrcona #info Dyrcona = Jason Stephenson, CW MARS
15:01 JBoyer #info JBoyer = Jason Boyer, Equinox
15:01 collum #info collum = Garry Collum, KCPL
15:01 jeffdavis #info jeffdavis = Jeff Davis, Sitka
15:02 Bmagic feel free to info yourself as you arrive
15:02 tslittle #info tslittle = Tiffany Little, PINES
15:02 Bmagic #topic Action Items from Last Meeting
15:02 Bmagic #info Dyrcona will communicate what our git users need to do as a result of these changes via email and blog posts.
15:02 Dyrcona #info Done!
15:02 Bmagic lol, nice
15:02 terranm Dyrcona++
15:03 Bmagic Dyrcona++ # indeed
15:03 mmorgan #info mmorgan = Michele Morgan, NOBLE
15:03 tslittle Dyrcona++
15:03 shulabear Dyrcona++ was very smooth process
15:03 Dyrcona I didn't get any questions, so I assume everyone has made the transition.
15:03 sleary Dyrcona++ it was very easy!
15:03 Dyrcona gmcharlt++ csharp_++
15:03 abneiman #info abneiman = Andrea Buntz Neiman, Equinox
15:03 Dyrcona They both did some important steps.
15:04 shulabear gmcharlt++ csharp_++
15:04 Bmagic great work!
15:04 berick #info berick Bill Erickson, KCLS
15:05 Bmagic I think we can move on, though I don't see berick, nvm
15:05 Bmagic #topic OpenSRF
15:05 berick Dyrcona++
15:05 Bmagic #info RUST timeline
15:05 Bmagic berick: I threw this on the agenda because it was bare. Feel free to tell me to move on
15:06 berick well...
15:06 berick not much so say on the Rust side at this point.  kind of waiting/hoping others will get interested and join the momentum
15:06 berick i did at this https://github.com/kcls/evergreen​-universe-rs/blob/main/PRIMER.md
15:06 berick tiny primer
15:07 berick i think the bigger question now is more about the Redis stuff, which has been decoupled from Rust now
15:07 berick and is ready for wider testing
15:07 Dyrcona berick++
15:07 Bmagic oh! berick++
15:07 Dyrcona I'll take a look.
15:08 Dyrcona It's time I pick up another programming language. Last year was lua.
15:08 shulabear I'm interested, but I'm also still learning Rust
15:08 shulabear berick++
15:08 Bmagic so, to be clear, you've coded some OpenSRF to use Redis without* Rust?
15:08 berick right, the Redis branches now fully function without Rust.
15:08 berick we're treateing them as 2 separate projects
15:09 Bmagic berick++
15:09 berick since there was (understandably) concern about rushing into Rust
15:10 Bmagic yes, it seems we could be causing us some undo treadmill work adopting Rust. Some good points were made over the email discussion
15:10 Dyrcona I think we should replace the back end C and Perl with Rust eventually, by that I mean the services.
15:11 jihpringle joined #evergreen
15:11 berick well get learnin! :)
15:11 Bmagic I think some good takeaways were that if we were to adopt Rust, we should use it more widely, which, of course, can be a monster project
15:12 berick exactly, if adding dependencies, make it worth it
15:13 Bmagic it's "cool" but other than that, the supporting reasons were: {help me fill in the blank here}
15:13 JBoyer To explain one of the points of concern; Debian won't have a packaged Rust until I think Bookworm; so, just last week, and only 1 supported version. Otherwise you're basically running rust-current, so to speak.
15:14 JBoyer It's nice to have some idea of what versions people are using rather than finding out that 1.14.3 works but 1.15.7 doesn't, etc.
15:15 jeffdavis It would be good to have ways of trying out/adopting Rust for EG stuff without making it an EG dependency yet.
15:16 jeffdavis egsh looks cool, thanks for sharing that
15:16 berick jeffdavis: you can
15:16 berick yeah, that ;)
15:16 berick but of course it depends on the Redis branches
15:16 berick so, it's a long game
15:17 jeffdavis kind of works as a roadmap though - there's some time to get up to speed on Rust while Redis dev continues, then ramp up with Rust once the Redis stuff is in main?
15:18 berick jeffdavis: yeah, pretty much
15:18 Bmagic I'm sure more discussions will be had, we can table it. Good to know that berick has Redis up for testing sans Rust!
15:18 Bmagic berick++ # for good measure
15:18 jeffdavis yeah, really excited for Redis and hoping the Rust interest takes off
15:18 JBoyer berick++
15:19 Bmagic #topic Evergreen
15:19 Bmagic #info Post 3.11.0 release feedback
15:19 Bmagic Anything anyone want to talk about here? Thanks gmcharlt for posting the fixed tarball!
15:20 Bmagic gmcharlt++
15:20 terranm gmcharlt++
15:21 Bmagic moving on
15:21 Bmagic #topic Documentation
15:21 Bmagic #info Recent change to the docs server build wrapper script (JBoyer / Bmagic)
15:21 mantis1 left #evergreen
15:21 Bmagic Again, the agenda was bare and I thought of this. Thanks JBoyer!
15:22 Bmagic Recap: it was possible for the nightly docs build to destroy the website if certain pieces weren't perfect. JBoyer introduced a change that mitigates the problem
15:23 Bmagic moving on
15:23 Bmagic #topic New Business
15:23 Bmagic #info New devs onboarding
15:23 Bmagic #info http://list.evergreen-ils.org/pipermai​l/evergreen-dev/2023-June/000573.html
15:24 Bmagic sleary: I agree with all of your points
15:24 sleary Thanks to everyone who offered feedback to my email!
15:25 Bmagic the floor is open
15:25 jeffdavis I can't formally commit to anything, but we're onboarding a new dev next month at Sitka and I'm hoping we can contribute to community documentation for new devs as part of that
15:26 terranm jeffdavis++
15:26 tslittle jeffdavis++
15:26 JBoyer jeffdavis++ Any efforts are appreciated.
15:26 sleary jeffdavis++ and congrats on the additional hands!
15:26 Bmagic jeffdavis++
15:26 jeffdavis The existing new devs stuff is SUPER helpful even in its WIP state!
15:26 terranm we're at 2nd interview phase for our open position and I'm hoping to have them work on documentation as part of their learning process as well
15:27 jeffdavis nice :)
15:27 sleary terranm++
15:27 shulabear terranm++
15:27 JBoyer terranm++
15:28 Bmagic the evergreen-release channel was created on a whim and it seemed at the time that it might have just been created to solve one issue, but then, we kept using it. That's how I remember it
15:28 sleary I think it's fine to have a separate channel; there just needs to be a way for people to find out about it.
15:29 sleary I initially assumed I couldn't see it because I was using the web client while fighting with Quassel/Windows 11
15:29 Bmagic And now that it exists, I do seem to think that it's better that all of that chatter is off this channel
15:29 sleary but I got that working and I still don't see it in the channel list
15:29 abneiman +1 to One Channel to Rule Them All
15:30 berick I also favor a single channel.
15:30 tslittle +1
15:30 berick best for learning
15:30 jeff is there a reason or a concern with public logs of the release channel? is part of the idea that there's not-public links/etc flying around during release time?
15:31 jeff i've no strong opinion either way on one-channel or many-channels, but support having a list of "official" project channels and making logs more readily available for those channels.
15:32 Bmagic hmmm, it's public as far as I know. The security stuff wouldn't be there (correct me if I'm wrong releaseers)
15:33 Dyrcona It's public, but it is not logged by the bots.
15:33 jeff sleary: I think the reason you can't see the channel in your IRC client is the same reason you wouldn't be able to see this channel if you weren't already in it: the channels are +s ("secret") to avoid being listed in the commands that spam bots use, etc. Something we did long ago, and could test removing if folk think +s is causing more trouble than its worth.
15:33 Bmagic I mean, the chatter is public
15:34 jeff I mention the above because I'm happy to be the one to set up logging / join the bots / list the channels on the wiki or web page / toggle channel modes as needed / etc.
15:34 Bmagic so, shall we remove it?
15:35 abneiman since it's not logged, is there a need / process to preserve its historic data?
15:35 jeffdavis I'm not against removing +s but I'm not sure it solves the underlying problem, which is that release discussion is siloed in an underadvertised channel?
15:36 Bmagic I mean reamove the whole channel
15:36 jeffdavis ah
15:36 jeffdavis well I'm ok with that :)
15:36 Dyrcona Is release discussion really generally useful?
15:36 mmorgan Since it's not logged, is there historic data to preserve?
15:36 jeff I mean, the channel is currently listed on the IRC page on the website. I don't know if that's a recent addition.
15:37 Dyrcona Individual users would have their logs of the channel conversation, but that's it.
15:37 Bmagic I didn't realize we put it on our website. That makes me sway back to keeping it
15:37 jeff The only historical data would exist in individual users logs. I don't know if that's worth pursuing.
15:37 JBoyer I suppose release chatter in here can show where some rough edges may be even if people don't otherwise make note of them.
15:38 JBoyer I think the mention on the site is less than a month old, so not a strong indicator of usefulness or need.
15:38 jeff (but that page contradicts itself at present, since it claims that "everything on IRC is public and logged"
15:38 jeff )
15:38 Bmagic It might be worth a broader email to the community?
15:39 jeff I think it's up to the folk making use of the channel: if you're a release team participant, do you need the channel as a useful tool to help you do your work? If so, keep, and plan to log unless there's a reason not to.
15:40 JBoyer I don't expect a lot of strong opinions from people not involved in releases. I have used it some, but would have just pinged people in here if not.
15:40 jeff The agenda item is about findability/discoverability of channels, I think. Deciding to stop using a channel is I suppose one creative way of solving the issue... :-)
15:41 Bmagic It gets noisy in short bursts. I really don't know what the answer is. Just keep it and move on?
15:41 sleary I don't think we need to resolve this today, and I know the board will be discussing Slack and other options as part of this week's agenda item on funding community tools
15:41 shulabear sleary++
15:41 mmorgan JBoyer brings up a point. Would removing the release channel just lead to more private conversation on IRC?
15:41 mmorgan Which would not be public, for sure.
15:41 Bmagic sounds good, leaving it alone for now
15:41 sleary Thank you to whoever added the other channels to the web page
15:42 Bmagic sleary: did you want to touch on any of those sub points?
15:43 sleary Not at present, but if anyone would like to claim to-do items, I will be happy to help with any of them after the ALA conference.
15:43 terranm Maybe keep that list on the agenda for the next few months to touch base on?
15:43 mmorgan +1
15:43 Bmagic yep
15:44 sleary +1
15:44 jeffdavis terranm++
15:44 Bmagic #topic Announcements
15:44 Bmagic #info Next meeting is July 18, 2023 (open for discussion)
15:45 * mmorgan added a last minute agenda item...
15:45 sleary Bmagic did mmorgan want to discuss Launchpad stats?
15:45 Bmagic oops, sorry, I didn't refresh
15:45 mmorgan :)
15:45 mmorgan I've been compiling Launchpad stats since 2021, happy to continue if they're useful.
15:45 Bmagic well, I guess it's just going to end up under Announcements
15:45 Bmagic #info Launchpad Stats - useful? (mmorgan)
15:46 mmorgan I've entered the stats up til now into this sheet:
15:46 mmorgan https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1igd02X0VjI​cJrGdmcEQ34bAha8b3IHYprHkdZhcOkkE/edit?usp=sharing
15:46 Bmagic #info https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1igd02X0VjI​cJrGdmcEQ34bAha8b3IHYprHkdZhcOkkE/edit?usp=sharing
15:46 mmorgan Also was playing with some charts, I'm happy to continue if this is useful info.
15:47 Bmagic I think it's great! mmorgan++
15:47 shulabear mmorgan++
15:47 terranm mmorgan++
15:47 collum mmorgan++
15:48 Bmagic I wonder if we can get some version of this up on the community site somewhere?
15:49 mmorgan Ok! Hoping this will show some trends and yield useful info as we move along.
15:49 Bmagic Maybe automated? For all I know, this has been done before and there is a project somewhere on github....
15:49 jeff mmorgan++ I think it's good to track metrics. We should consider if there are any others that we would like to track, and please speak up if you'd like help automating the task or otherwise lightening your burden. :-)
15:49 mmorgan I'm all for getting it on the communit site, and automating!
15:49 sleary Bmagic certainly. I have some WordPress charts and graphs plugins stashed... somewhere. I'll put it on the website fixer-upper to-do list
15:50 mmorgan jeff++
15:50 mmorgan read my mind!
15:50 Bmagic very cool, yes! I'm for seeing this data easily. It can only help us
15:50 terranm +1
15:51 shulabear +1
15:51 Bmagic do we have an action item here?
15:51 mmorgan #action mmorgan will explore moving LP stats to community site and automating same
15:51 Bmagic ty
15:52 Bmagic Looping back to the next meeting date. Everyone OK with moving to the following week from our normal in July?
15:52 Bmagic July 18th
15:52 Dyrcona Bmagic: Anyw particular reason?
15:53 Bmagic I'm on vacation that week
15:53 Dyrcona :)
15:53 Bmagic we're down to a couple minutes
15:53 Dyrcona I'm OK with moving the date of the meeting.
15:54 sleary +1
15:54 jeffdavis date change works for me
15:54 collum +1
15:54 mmorgan no objection from me
15:54 Bmagic #topic Feedback for New Features Under Development
15:54 Bmagic #info Enhanced concerto improvements (date carry) Lp 1901932
15:54 pinesol Launchpad bug 1901932 in Evergreen "Wish List - Enhanced Concerto dataset" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1901932
15:55 Bmagic not sure if it's worth soaking up the time, but I did update that branch to deal with the dates
15:55 terranm Bmagic++
15:55 jeffdavis I wonder if it would be worth opening a new bug for the updates? easy to miss otherwise
15:55 Bmagic Anyone want to plug their patch with these last 5 minutes?
15:55 berick isn't it already merged?
15:56 Bmagic berick: see comment #8
15:56 Bmagic for tracking reasons, I wasn't sure. Yes, I can make another LP bug
15:56 berick +1 to new bug
15:56 mmorgan +1
15:56 gmcharlt yeah, falls in the general rule that comments in fix released bugs can easily be missed
15:56 Bmagic #action Bmagic will create a new LP bug for the Enhanced concerto code updates
15:57 gmcharlt (e.g., most of my committer workflow is tied to LP queries that ignore fixed-relesaed bugs
15:57 Bmagic any other patches to throw in here?
15:57 Bmagic gmcharlt: makes sense
15:57 terranm No patches, but I just rolled out our first HTML action trigger notification and it makes me happy!
15:58 Bmagic awesome!
15:58 mmorgan terranm++
15:58 Bmagic terranm++
15:58 shulabear terranm++ It looks great!
15:58 sleary terranm++ \o/
15:58 terranm These are the mockups of what they will all look like when I'm done - https://pines.georgialibraries.org/notices/
15:59 collum terranm++
15:59 mmorgan Oooh! Really nice!
15:59 Bmagic Thanks everyone, calling it
15:59 Bmagic #endmeeting
15:59 pinesol Meeting ended Tue Jun 13 15:59:15 2023 US/Eastern.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
15:59 pinesol Minutes:        http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2023/evergreen.2023-06-13-15.00.html
15:59 pinesol Minutes (text): http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2023/evergreen.2023-06-13-15.00.txt
15:59 pinesol Log:            http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergree​n/2023/evergreen.2023-06-13-15.00.log.html
15:59 JBoyer terranm++
15:59 terranm Ciaaaaaoooo
15:59 JBoyer Bmagic++
15:59 shulabear Bmagic++
15:59 mmorgan Bmagic++
15:59 dluch Very cool, terranm!!
15:59 mmorgan gmcharlt++
16:00 dluch Bmagic++
16:00 mmorgan JBoyer++
16:00 mmorgan sleary++
16:00 mmorgan jeffdavis++
16:00 Bmagic Dyrcona: I seem to remember you having coummunity calendar powers
16:01 berick Bmagic++
16:06 jvwoolf Aw shoot I missed the meeting
16:07 jvwoolf terranm: Those notifications looks AWESOME!
16:07 jvwoolf look*
16:08 kmlussier joined #evergreen
16:08 kmlussier ping
16:08 kmlussier Oops, wrong place. You can ignore that. :)
16:09 jvwoolf left #evergreen
16:12 eeevil terranm: the html notice mockups look really good!
16:12 Dyrcona Bmagic: I do. I'll Update the calendar.
16:13 Bmagic Dyrcona++
16:16 Dyrcona It might be a while before others see the change.
16:19 sleary_ joined #evergreen
16:51 jeff gmcharlt: in a recent comment on bug 1483496 you mentioned "evergreen.change_db_setting() will be removed shortly" -- I'm wondering if there's additional context to that? I've no objection, just curiosity.
16:51 pinesol Launchpad bug 1483496 in Evergreen "evergreen.change_db_setting needs test" [Undecided,Won't fix] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1483496
16:52 gmcharlt jeff: a pending security fix
16:52 jeff ah. :-)
17:02 mmorgan left #evergreen
19:39 jihpringle joined #evergreen
20:50 sleary joined #evergreen
21:20 Christineb_ joined #evergreen
21:20 denials joined #evergreen
21:20 StomproJ joined #evergreen
21:20 gmcharlt_ joined #evergreen
21:20 Jaysal_ joined #evergreen
21:20 StomproJ joined #evergreen
21:21 Christineb_ joined #evergreen
21:23 gmcharlt joined #evergreen
21:23 Jaysal joined #evergreen
21:25 dbs joined #evergreen
21:29 bshum joined #evergreen
21:34 jonadab joined #evergreen
23:10 stompro__ joined #evergreen

| Channels | #evergreen index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary | Join Webchat