| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 06:15 |
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| 07:24 |
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| 07:55 |
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| 08:43 |
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| 09:13 |
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| 09:17 |
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| 09:21 |
Bmagic |
good mornin all |
| 09:22 |
kmlussier |
Bmagic: Good morning! Happy Thursday! |
| 09:22 |
mmorgan |
Good Morning! |
| 09:22 |
Bmagic |
@coffee [someone] |
| 09:23 |
* pinesol_green |
brews and pours a cup of Honey Pot Espresso, and sends it sliding down the bar to pastebot |
| 09:23 |
Bmagic |
lol, second helpings for the pastebot |
| 09:23 |
Bmagic |
I think the pastebot is secretly a spy attempting to bring the resistance down! |
| 09:24 |
kmlussier |
pastebot: Stop stealing our caffeine! |
| 09:24 |
kmlussier |
@coffee [someone] |
| 09:25 |
* pinesol_green |
brews and pours a cup of Panama El Burro Estate, and sends it sliding down the bar to wjr |
| 09:25 |
pastebot |
Someone at 64.57.241.14 pasted "o$$$$$$oo o$" "$oo $ o""""$o "" (48 lines) at http://paste.evergreen-ils.org/27 |
| 09:25 |
kmlussier |
I can tell it's going to be one of those mornings. Changed a setting on mlnc2 and then I couldn't figure out why it didn't make a difference in my search on mlnc1. |
| 09:26 |
mmorgan |
Too many servers :) |
| 09:28 |
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| 09:34 |
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| 09:41 |
tsbere |
kmlussier: Could be worse. I made changes yesterday to vim configs on a server and then couldn't figure out why it wasn't taking....only to realize "oh, wait, that is my *local* gvim, not the server's vim...." |
| 09:43 |
kmlussier |
tsbere: Yeah, that sounds like something I would do. |
| 09:53 |
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| 09:53 |
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| 09:58 |
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| 10:03 |
kmlussier |
Bmagic: Do you want a pullrequest tag on bug 1403907? |
| 10:03 |
pinesol_green |
Launchpad bug 1403907 in Evergreen "E-resources not included in ver 2.7.1 Group formats and editions search" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1403907 |
| 10:17 |
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| 10:33 |
Bmagic |
kmlussier: sounds good |
| 10:48 |
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| 10:50 |
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| 11:12 |
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| 11:13 |
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| 11:15 |
JBoyer |
ncip-- |
| 11:15 |
JBoyer |
mod_dumpio++ |
| 11:39 |
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| 11:55 |
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| 11:59 |
jeff |
hah |
| 12:00 |
jeff |
"As can be expected, this can produce extreme volumes of data" |
| 12:00 |
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| 12:07 |
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maryj joined #evergreen |
| 12:24 |
_bott_ |
I've got a test 2.10 install, and while logged into the web client, I'm getting multiple calls to open-ils.auth.session.retrieve per second while the session is sitting idle. If left sitting, it quickly logs thousands of requests. |
| 12:25 |
berick |
that sounds familiar.. |
| 12:25 |
berick |
maybe something to do with the auth timeout setting |
| 12:29 |
tsbere |
that, to me, sounds like background updating of something going nuts |
| 12:32 |
berick |
_bott_: http://irc.evergreen-ils.org/evergreen/2016-06-14#i_253093 |
| 12:36 |
_bott_ |
berick:++ |
| 13:21 |
jeff |
ack. I didn't file a bug on that one. |
| 13:22 |
* jeff |
does so |
| 13:26 |
jeff |
really not liking that i seem to get hung apache processes when testing webstaff stuff. |
| 13:26 |
|
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| 13:26 |
berick |
jeff: are they regular apache procs or websocket procs? |
| 13:27 |
jeff |
i don't think it's a problem with mod_websocket, because it's the main apache instance... but it could be something that's only encountered on a system that sits idle. |
| 13:27 |
jeff |
berick: regular |
| 13:27 |
berick |
k |
| 13:28 |
berick |
the browser client is leveraging (regular) apache a whole lot less than the tpac, but still based on the same TT processing code |
| 13:29 |
berick |
i'm a little surprised it would be the cause of apache probs |
| 13:30 |
jeff |
when this happened on another more test-only system, it was something i could usually reproduce. at this very moment i'm having trouble reproducing. |
| 13:31 |
jeff |
nevermind, got it. |
| 13:31 |
jeff |
well, "reproduced" |
| 13:38 |
jeff |
it seemed to be an apache child getting stuck, and just not responding at all to the client. |
| 13:39 |
jeff |
at this point, the server sees no tcp session, and the client (Chrome on OS X) is sitting spinning with a blank page, thinking that it's waiting on the server. |
| 13:39 |
jeff |
at this point i only have one side of the tcp session, i'm gathering more data. |
| 13:40 |
jeff |
one thing i'm trying to keep in mind is that this may not be the same as the previous time i had similar symptoms. trying not to combine observations. :-) |
| 13:41 |
|
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| 13:42 |
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| 13:45 |
berick |
on an unrelated note, anyone doing any audit table maintenance / cleanup? |
| 13:47 |
bshum |
berick: What kind of cleanup are you looking at? |
| 13:47 |
* bshum |
imagines KCLS can generate some churn every day... |
| 13:48 |
berick |
bshum: asset_copy_history is a beast. .5B rows and 124G disk and dog slow to query. don't need all that. thinking about only keeping the last X entries per copy. |
| 13:50 |
berick |
in its current state, keeping 10 entries per copy would drop it down to about 80M rows. |
| 13:50 |
berick |
wondering if anyone's done anything like that |
| 13:51 |
kmlussier |
berick: I'm fairly sure C/W MARS does some audit table cleanup. I can check. |
| 13:52 |
berick |
thanks kmlussier |
| 13:53 |
kmlussier |
Oh, I didn't realize tspindler was here. He might be better able to answer berick's question than me. |
| 13:54 |
terran |
csharp: we limit what we keep in our audit tables don't we? |
| 13:54 |
tspindler |
berick: we are |
| 13:55 |
tspindler |
I'd have to go back and check but we were either keeping 3months or 6 months of audit table records |
| 13:55 |
berick |
tspindler: ah, good to know, was wondering if anyone did time-based cleanup |
| 13:56 |
tspindler |
berick: in our experience we almost never use the data that is actually more than a month old |
| 13:56 |
graced |
Five minute warning for the EOB meeting |
| 13:57 |
berick |
tspindler: awesome, thanks for the feedback |
| 13:59 |
jeff |
oh hey, it's IDL2js. |
| 14:00 |
|
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| 14:01 |
collum |
berick: we keep 120 days in the audit tables. |
| 14:01 |
berick |
collum: cool, thanks |
| 14:02 |
graced |
#startmeeting Evergreen Oversight Board Meeting, July 21, 2016 |
| 14:02 |
pinesol_green |
Meeting started Thu Jul 21 14:02:03 2016 US/Eastern. The chair is graced. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. |
| 14:02 |
pinesol_green |
Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. |
| 14:02 |
pinesol_green |
The meeting name has been set to 'evergreen_oversight_board_meeting__july_21__2016' |
| 14:02 |
graced |
#link Agenda http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?id=governance:minutes:2016-7-21 |
| 14:02 |
graced |
#link http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?id=community:using-meetbot |
| 14:02 |
graced |
Meetbot command cheatsheet |
| 14:02 |
graced |
#topic Introductions |
| 14:02 |
graced |
Oversight Board members, please introduce yourself with #info |
| 14:02 |
graced |
#info graced is Grace Dunbar, Equinox |
| 14:02 |
rfrasur |
#info rfrasur is Ruth Frasur, Hagerstown Library, Evergreen Indiana |
| 14:02 |
terran |
#terran is Terran McCanna, PINES, Georgia Public Library Service |
| 14:03 |
collum |
#info collum is Garry Collum, Kenton County Public Library |
| 14:03 |
tspindler |
#info tspindler is Tim Spindler, C/W MARS |
| 14:03 |
miker |
#info miker is Mike Rylander, Equinox |
| 14:03 |
|
sherbertbc joined #evergreen |
| 14:04 |
rfrasur |
terran, can you info yourself again? |
| 14:04 |
terran |
sorry |
| 14:04 |
graced |
Amy and Ron notified me in advance that they will not be able to join us today. |
| 14:04 |
graced |
We have a quorum. |
| 14:04 |
terran |
#info terran is Terran McCanna, PINES, Georgia Public Library Service |
| 14:04 |
sherbertbc |
#info sherbertbc is Sharon Herbert, Sitka/BCLC |
| 14:05 |
graced |
#topic Approve Minutes/Actions from last meeting |
| 14:05 |
graced |
The minutes have been up for review since our last meeting. |
| 14:05 |
graced |
#link http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergreen/2016/evergreen.2016-06-16-14.01.html |
| 14:05 |
graced |
Are there any corrections? |
| 14:06 |
rfrasur |
looks copacetic to me. |
| 14:06 |
terran |
no corrections here |
| 14:06 |
graced |
Hearing no requests for corrections... |
| 14:06 |
graced |
#agreed The EOB accepted the minutes from 6/16/2016 |
| 14:06 |
graced |
#topic Old Business and Action items |
| 14:06 |
graced |
#info graced was tasked with reconciling the 2016 numbers between Tanya's budget tracking spreadsheet and the Conservancy's ledger. |
| 14:07 |
graced |
#info I have made a lot of headway on this task but am still awaiting a few pieces of information, particularly on that one outstanding payment I mentioned in my email. |
| 14:07 |
graced |
#link http://list.evergreen-ils.org/pipermail/eg-oversight-board/2016-July/001487.html |
| 14:07 |
graced |
Questions regarding the action item? (The agenda says we will be discussing more conference related issues in a bit…) |
| 14:07 |
tspindler |
a lot of forensic accounting |
| 14:07 |
rfrasur |
Yeah, and thanks for taking that on. |
| 14:08 |
graced |
It's become a specialty of mine lately... :) |
| 14:08 |
rfrasur |
I'm not sure that that's a good thing in general, but good in this case. |
| 14:08 |
terran |
This was clearly very needed, thank you graced++ and gcharlt++ |
| 14:08 |
rfrasur |
agreed on the graced++ and gcharlt++ |
| 14:08 |
graced |
Happy to do it as it led to some interesting discoveries... |
| 14:09 |
graced |
But, really we're waiting on confirmation of that one large payment and or actual payment. Then we should be able to put it to bed. |
| 14:09 |
graced |
If there are not any further wuestions on that action item... |
| 14:09 |
terran |
I apologize I haven't had time to read it closely yet - |
| 14:09 |
graced |
*questions |
| 14:09 |
tspindler |
graced: once you have the informaiton about payments will all be answered |
| 14:09 |
terran |
If those payments came through, will we have made a profit instead of a loss? |
| 14:10 |
graced |
terran, you're on vacation aren't you? I think you get a pass... |
| 14:10 |
graced |
If that payment comes through we should make a profit, yes. |
| 14:10 |
terran |
graced: yes, on a borrowed computer with none of my notes here :) |
| 14:10 |
graced |
dedication++ |
| 14:11 |
graced |
moving on |
| 14:11 |
rfrasur |
graced: if that payment comes through and accounting for the weird SFC stuff, will the conference balance? |
| 14:11 |
graced |
rfrasur: hopefully - we'll at least be very close |
| 14:11 |
rfrasur |
Okay, great. Thanks. |
| 14:11 |
terran |
I hope we'll be able to use this to help the next conference tracking |
| 14:11 |
tspindler |
graced: can we also find out why the sfc is taking money out before we received payments |
| 14:12 |
rfrasur |
tspindler++ |
| 14:12 |
graced |
tspindler: yes, let's save that discussion for a bit further in the agenda? |
| 14:12 |
tspindler |
ok |
| 14:12 |
graced |
#info gmcharlt was tasked to run reports as needed for graced to perform the above. Which he did. |
| 14:12 |
graced |
#info rfrasur was tasked with scheduling the first ROGER meeting via Doodle. Which she and tspindler both did. :) |
| 14:12 |
graced |
Any outstanding issues with those agenda items? |
| 14:12 |
rfrasur |
We're super responsive. |
| 14:13 |
graced |
#info graced to send revised Executive Session wording for review. Which I did… belatedly. |
| 14:13 |
graced |
I expect we’ll have some further discussion/questions on it and can either vote on it via email or at the next meeting. |
| 14:13 |
graced |
And I apologize for sending updates to all my action items mere hours before this meeting. :-/ |
| 14:14 |
graced |
And lastly, from our action items... |
| 14:14 |
graced |
#info sherbertbc is going to investigate OSS grants. |
| 14:14 |
graced |
sherbertbc: any progress/updates there? |
| 14:15 |
sherbertbc |
sorry, have had no time this month, but will next! |
| 14:15 |
graced |
fair enough |
| 14:16 |
graced |
Is there is any further old business? |
| 14:16 |
graced |
#action sherbertbc to continue investigating OSS grants as time permits |
| 14:16 |
miker |
agenda updated with the financials link from gmcharlt |
| 14:16 |
graced |
thanks miker |
| 14:17 |
graced |
old business going once... |
| 14:17 |
terran |
Just a comment on the first ROGER meeting - I thought it went well and we made a good start, thanks to tspindler++ and all! |
| 14:17 |
rfrasur |
agreed. |
| 14:17 |
miker |
terran: I think that discussion is coming soon :) |
| 14:17 |
miker |
but, yes |
| 14:17 |
* graced |
hopes I put that on the agenda... |
| 14:18 |
terran |
I see it now! |
| 14:18 |
graced |
okay moving on! |
| 14:18 |
graced |
#topic New Business |
| 14:18 |
graced |
#info Financial Update |
| 14:18 |
graced |
#link http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?id=governance:financials:update_2016_07_21 |
| 14:19 |
graced |
#info The Project is $29,114.80 in the black. |
| 14:19 |
graced |
gmcharlt++ thank you for continuing to handle these financial reports! |
| 14:19 |
terran |
gmcharlt++ |
| 14:19 |
tspindler |
gmcharlt++ |
| 14:19 |
graced |
Questions about the financial health of Evergreen? |
| 14:19 |
collum |
gmcharlt++ |
| 14:19 |
rfrasur |
gmcharlt+ |
| 14:19 |
rfrasur |
gmcharlt++ too |
| 14:19 |
gmcharlt |
(note that I've just updated http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?id=governance:financials:update_2016_07_21 to account for the pens) |
| 14:20 |
rfrasur |
graced, do you know...offhand where we are relative to the same time last year? |
| 14:20 |
gmcharlt |
http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?id=governance:financials |
| 14:20 |
rfrasur |
Thank you. |
| 14:20 |
graced |
gmcharlt: your fingers are faster than mine |
| 14:21 |
rfrasur |
So, nothing that...and acknowledging that it's not a great decrease, I'd just put out there that we need to be purposeful about increasing year over year. |
| 14:21 |
rfrasur |
Which seems a little silly to have to say, but silly is in my skillset. |
| 14:21 |
graced |
Agreed. The goal should be to increase the money we have |
| 14:22 |
graced |
And the conference is the biggest area where we *can* bring in revenue. |
| 14:23 |
terran |
Agreed. |
| 14:23 |
rfrasur |
I don't think it's something we should get into today, but definitely a conversation that needs to be had about that bottom line, goals, and strategies. |
| 14:23 |
tspindler |
has a financial target ever been set based on a strategic goal? |
| 14:23 |
tspindler |
rfrasur++ |
| 14:23 |
graced |
tspindler: not to my knowledge |
| 14:23 |
graced |
but it is something to strive for |
| 14:24 |
tspindler |
i like saving money but it should be oriented towards something but i agree it is a separate conversation best left for another time |
| 14:24 |
graced |
Well, it's nice to have money in the bank in case we ever need to say, defend a trademark infringement lawsuit. |
| 14:24 |
graced |
Lawyers and filing fees are expensive |
| 14:24 |
rfrasur |
Yep. |
| 14:25 |
tspindler |
i agree that is a valid goal |
| 14:25 |
graced |
But yes, not just saving money for money's sake. |
| 14:25 |
* graced |
wonders if we could all meet during the fall hackfest to do some planning |
| 14:26 |
graced |
Okay... moving on |
| 14:26 |
graced |
#topic Committee Reports |
| 14:26 |
rfrasur |
Do we have dates for that? (pardon...I think I can just look that up) |
| 14:27 |
graced |
#topic Conference Committee |
| 14:27 |
graced |
#info Venue contract is signed for 2017. Grace and the conference committee will be working with the local hosts over the next four weeks to get everything moving in the right direction. |
| 14:27 |
graced |
Now that I have the 2016 stuff mostly sorted I am turning all my attention to 2017. |
| 14:27 |
graced |
Any questions for the Conference Committee? |
| 14:28 |
terran |
Is there anything the rest of us need to do to assist at this point? |
| 14:28 |
graced |
terran: I am about to inundate the conference committee - get your reading glasses and your calculator ready. ;-) |
| 14:28 |
terran |
;) |
| 14:28 |
* rfrasur |
prepares. |
| 14:29 |
graced |
FYI, the conference dates are 4/5-4/8 |
| 14:29 |
graced |
#topic Outreach Committee Business |
| 14:29 |
graced |
#info The Outreach committee update is in the agenda. |
| 14:30 |
graced |
Questions for Outreach? |
| 14:30 |
graced |
FYI, the ALA meetup was great, I think we should definitely do it again |
| 14:30 |
terran |
+1 |
| 14:30 |
kmlussier |
Yes, absolutely! |
| 14:30 |
tspindler |
+1 |
| 14:31 |
graced |
kmlussier++ |
| 14:31 |
terran |
kmlussier++ |
| 14:31 |
graced |
#topic Release Manager's Report |
| 14:31 |
graced |
miker: anything to report yet for 2.11? |
| 14:31 |
miker |
dbwells has been wrangling his fellow buildmasters |
| 14:32 |
miker |
they had a practice session this weds for about 2 hours |
| 14:32 |
miker |
they are rubbing some sharp edges off the build process, so the future should be bright and this release should be clean |
| 14:32 |
terran |
dbwells++ |
| 14:33 |
miker |
I'm targetting branches to merge over the next few weeks to try and avoid the beta rush |
| 14:33 |
terran |
miker++ |
| 14:33 |
graced |
all y'all++ |
| 14:33 |
miker |
but going is slow for me -- I've been swamped during the day and gone most weekends |
| 14:34 |
miker |
finally, ... |
| 14:34 |
miker |
dbwells and I will be looking through the i18n stuff soon, based on the recent translations thread on the dev mailing list |
| 14:35 |
miker |
dbwells++ # poking the poker |
| 14:35 |
graced |
nifty! |
| 14:35 |
graced |
thanks miker |
| 14:35 |
graced |
#topic Rules of Governance Review Committee |
| 14:35 |
graced |
tspindler? |
| 14:36 |
tspindler |
we have a meeting set for august 8 |
| 14:36 |
tspindler |
Ron, Miker and I are looking at the conflict of interest policy |
| 14:37 |
graced |
#info next Roger meeting set for 8/8 |
| 14:37 |
tspindler |
terran pulled some info together for out of date content |
| 14:37 |
tspindler |
we will present these on the 8th for discussion |
| 14:38 |
graced |
sounds good |
| 14:38 |
graced |
any questions for tspindler? |
| 14:38 |
graced |
tspindler++ |
| 14:39 |
rfrasur |
tspindler++ |
| 14:39 |
terran |
we are using the sfc conflict of interest policy as inspiration - it's really thoughtfully put together and comprehensive |
| 14:39 |
rfrasur |
and terran++ |
| 14:39 |
terran |
tspindler++ |
| 14:40 |
graced |
#topic SFC responsiveness |
| 14:40 |
graced |
#info It took me 3 months and many emails to get the new officers listed with the SFC and the mailing list at evergreen sfconservancy.org corrected. |
| 14:41 |
rfrasur |
Yeah, noted. And then a comment about "not checking" something regularly. |
| 14:41 |
graced |
The thing that was most troubling to me was the follow up email, as rfrasur just mentioned. |
| 14:41 |
graced |
Where it was stated, “I'm not really monitoring the PLC aliases anymore although I'm still on them mainly for archival purposes.” |
| 14:41 |
graced |
That email list is supposed to be our point of contract to talk the them. |
| 14:41 |
graced |
*contact |
| 14:42 |
rfrasur |
After all the hullabaloo over the winter/spring about who's getting what emails. |
| 14:42 |
tspindler |
are they really short staffed or is there another reason for this? |
| 14:42 |
graced |
indeed... I don't feel like we're getting reasonable service. |
| 14:42 |
rfrasur |
I'd have thought it was a pretty major concern that those things be managed efficiently. |
| 14:42 |
terran |
Did they say if there was a different way we are supposed to contact them instead? |
| 14:42 |
graced |
terran: they did not |
| 14:43 |
graced |
though I did email karen and bradley directly at one point, too and still did not receive a response. |
| 14:44 |
graced |
I know they have a small staff but that doesn't mean we should have to wait 3 months for simple mailing list changes. |
| 14:44 |
rfrasur |
So, what thoughts do people have about any action/nonaction? |
| 14:44 |
terran |
As Amy is our liaison to them, perhaps we should wait until she can participate in the conversation? |
| 14:45 |
tspindler |
My first thought is to communicate that communication is a problem but it sounds like a comedy routine |
| 14:45 |
rfrasur |
terran, I think that's probably reasonable. |
| 14:45 |
graced |
I feel like we should discuss our concerns and present them to Karen at the SFC - we can do so on the mailing list with Amy's input/assistance |
| 14:45 |
terran |
Agreed |
| 14:45 |
collum |
Agreed |
| 14:45 |
rfrasur |
I'm down with that. |
| 14:45 |
tspindler |
Agreed |
| 14:46 |
miker |
+1 |
| 14:46 |
terran |
Not to get into it deeply here, but if we broke off the relationship with the SFC, what would our other general options be? |
| 14:46 |
graced |
#action graced will kick off the email thread with a recap of issues, both recent and ongoing. |
| 14:46 |
rfrasur |
terran, if I remember correctly, there's another similar org. Or we could go it alone. Sort of. |
| 14:46 |
graced |
Another 501c3 |
| 14:47 |
graced |
creating our own |
| 14:47 |
graced |
Using them for some things but not others (conference mgmt) |
| 14:47 |
tspindler |
we would need more money to kick it off i think to start our own 501c3 |
| 14:47 |
terran |
That's an enormous amount of work, too. |
| 14:47 |
miker |
tspindler: not following ... what expenses are you thinking of? |
| 14:47 |
rfrasur |
So, let's start the conversation in email about how to approach the conservancy |
| 14:48 |
rfrasur |
miker: there are articles of incorporation (which we might already have) that have to be filed in a State of Record. A place has to be established...then there needs to be the actual filing with the IRS. |
| 14:48 |
tspindler |
i have to look it up but when you exceed a certain revenue stream there are auditing requirements and filing |
| 14:49 |
miker |
rfrasur: sure, but those are tiny expenses |
| 14:49 |
rfrasur |
Yeah, there's that as well. I don't remember the exact number though. I was thinking it was $50k |
| 14:49 |
tspindler |
as terran points ou, it can be a lot of work |
| 14:49 |
rfrasur |
miker: indeed |
| 14:49 |
graced |
Well, I bet we can talk this to death in email. ;-) |
| 14:49 |
rfrasur |
Yup, so let's start with where we're at and see what comes of that... |
| 14:49 |
terran |
+1 |
| 14:50 |
graced |
But thanks for kickstarting the thoughts on what's entailed |
| 14:50 |
graced |
there are a lot of options available to us |
| 14:50 |
rfrasur |
and we can continue to tangentially pull together more information in case we gotta or wanna go in a diff direction. |
| 14:50 |
graced |
It never hurts to survey the landscape |
| 14:50 |
rfrasur |
nope |
| 14:51 |
graced |
Lastly, let's talk about the 10% issue I discovered in the books |
| 14:51 |
tspindler |
has the annual budget been in the range of 30K? |
| 14:51 |
kmlussier |
FYI: The other organization is http://www.spi-inc.org/. But, IIRC, when Ben Hyman reached out to them, he didn't get a response. |
| 14:52 |
graced |
tspindler: do you mean income? |
| 14:52 |
rfrasur |
kmlussier, that's my recollection. |
| 14:52 |
tspindler |
graced: yes |
| 14:52 |
graced |
tspindler: it fluctuates depending on the conference venue, tbh |
| 14:53 |
graced |
the conference $$ is our biggest source of income |
| 14:53 |
graced |
and most of it flows right back out to cover costs |
| 14:54 |
rfrasur |
So, the 10% |
| 14:54 |
graced |
Yes, the 10%... |
| 14:54 |
rfrasur |
Why is the SFC taking money out as registrations are occurring? |
| 14:54 |
graced |
did anyone look at the Fiscal Agreement doc to see if my interpretation looked correct? |
| 14:54 |
tspindler |
i did not |
| 14:55 |
miker |
rfrasur: their argument would be because invoiced conf registrations are non-refundable |
| 14:55 |
miker |
so theoretically they'll always be paid |
| 14:55 |
rfrasur |
miker: that's a ridiculous argument. |
| 14:55 |
miker |
and yet... |
| 14:55 |
miker |
;) |
| 14:56 |
miker |
but that's less concerning to me than the way the reversal was handled |
| 14:56 |
tspindler |
does the ledger allow you to distinguish invoiced from paid receipts? |
| 14:56 |
miker |
or, not handled, to be more accurate |
| 14:56 |
rfrasur |
they took money out before money was even received, if I'm reading the whole thing correctly. essentially billing the library and billing the project based on an invoice that wasn't paid. |
| 14:56 |
graced |
rfrasur: yes |
| 14:57 |
graced |
tspindler: yes, but it's weird |
| 14:57 |
* graced |
would have to look again to tell you how... |
| 14:58 |
tspindler |
graced: thanks, i'm just thinking if they took money based on a paid receipt ledger entry instead of invoiced it would be a better process |
| 14:58 |
rfrasur |
And how then that money was not completely refunded to the project and a NEW invoice issued when the initial invoice to the library was converted to bad debt |
| 14:58 |
graced |
I don't expect anyone to have any answers on this issue today but I wanted to give you the opportunity to ask me (or gmchrlt) any questions during the meeting |
| 14:58 |
rfrasur |
rather than refunding some partial amount to make the bottom line balance but not establishing a "paper" trail of clear transactions. |
| 14:59 |
graced |
tspindler: absolutely. But the ledger entry shouldn't be marked paid unless it is *actually* paid... |
| 14:59 |
tspindler |
the problem is clear in my mind but i wonder if getting a satisfactory response will be problematic |
| 14:59 |
miker |
rfrasur: right. and in the end the SFC walks away with an extra $13 because of their "no refunds on invoices" policy |
| 14:59 |
graced |
tspindler: you've hit upon the problem as I see it. |
| 15:00 |
tspindler |
miker: would it make a difference if we changed our policy |
| 15:00 |
graced |
I don't feel like we'll get a satisfactory response from the SFC on this... but I'm happy to let Amy try, of course. :) |
| 15:00 |
miker |
tspindler: it's not ours |
| 15:00 |
miker |
they make up that policy |
| 15:00 |
tspindler |
oy vey |
| 15:00 |
graced |
it's the SFC policy, unfortunately |
| 15:00 |
rfrasur |
Hmm |
| 15:01 |
rfrasur |
Just stating that I don't like that at all. |
| 15:01 |
graced |
Perhaps they will be willing to hear our concerns and make some changes... if we can figure out which email to use to talk to them. :P |
| 15:01 |
miker |
graced: tony's works well! :) |
| 15:02 |
graced |
Tony is the only reason we got our email issues fixed yesterday |
| 15:02 |
graced |
FYI |
| 15:02 |
graced |
Tony is the lawyer at the SFC, I have had a lot of very positive interactions with him and he is always responsive. |
| 15:03 |
graced |
Anyhow... we're pretty much at an hour and I can feel you all slipping away.... |
| 15:03 |
rfrasur |
Were there some conference things you were going to be throwing at us...or is that in email? |
| 15:03 |
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| 15:03 |
graced |
email for the conference committee |
| 15:04 |
rfrasur |
Okay, got it. |
| 15:04 |
graced |
For the next meeting please remember to preface your committee updates with the #info command. Otherwise... unless there is any other new business or further discussion? |
| 15:04 |
collum |
The fiscal agreement states that 'the project agrees to donate ten percent of its gross revenue...', but it seems like they are taking their cut before it's actually revenue. |
| 15:04 |
graced |
collum++ |
| 15:04 |
graced |
indeed |
| 15:04 |
miker |
collum: yes |
| 15:04 |
tspindler |
collum++ |
| 15:04 |
graced |
#info The fiscal agreement states that 'the project agrees to donate ten percent of its gross revenue...', but it seems like they are taking their cut before it's actually revenue. |
| 15:04 |
rfrasur |
collum++ thank you |
| 15:05 |
graced |
Thanks everyone! |
| 15:05 |
graced |
#endmeeting |
| 15:05 |
pinesol_green |
Meeting ended Thu Jul 21 15:05:27 2016 US/Eastern. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) |
| 15:05 |
pinesol_green |
Minutes: http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergreen/2016/evergreen.2016-07-21-14.02.html |
| 15:05 |
pinesol_green |
Minutes (text): http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergreen/2016/evergreen.2016-07-21-14.02.txt |
| 15:05 |
pinesol_green |
Log: http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergreen/2016/evergreen.2016-07-21-14.02.log.html |
| 15:05 |
tspindler |
doesn't seem to fallow GAAP |
| 15:05 |
graced |
sorry tspindler! |
| 15:05 |
tspindler |
not important |
| 15:05 |
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| 15:06 |
graced |
well it is important but I'm sure we'll cover it in email |
| 15:06 |
miker |
AR != revenue, who knew?!?!? |
| 15:06 |
terran |
Sorry, my internet connection died for a few minutes. Thanks all. |
| 15:06 |
kmlussier |
jihpringle / Christineb_away: Are either of you around for a quick acq question? |
| 15:06 |
kmlussier |
graced++ |
| 15:06 |
collum |
Thanks all. graced++ |
| 15:07 |
tspindler |
graced++ |
| 15:07 |
terran |
Back to vacation now :D |
| 15:07 |
terran |
And to put something on my dune buggy sunburn |
| 15:07 |
kmlussier |
terran: Enjoy! |
| 15:09 |
jihpringle |
kmlussier: hi |
| 15:09 |
kmlussier |
jihpringle: Hello! :) |
| 15:09 |
kmlussier |
I was just testing jeffdavis 's fix for bug 1589586. |
| 15:09 |
pinesol_green |
Launchpad bug 1589586 in Evergreen master "Acquisitions: Cannot prorate charges on invoice" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1589586 |
| 15:10 |
kmlussier |
It's working well for me, but, while testing, I tried adding direct charges on a PO rather than an invoice. |
| 15:10 |
kmlussier |
I found the same issue occurs there with prorated direct charges. But it seems to also happen on 2.9. I was wondering if you know if that's always been an issue on the PO? |
| 15:11 |
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| 15:11 |
jihpringle |
we stopped using charges on POs several versions ago because they never seemed to work quite right |
| 15:11 |
kmlussier |
I don't know if our users ever add direct charges from the PO, so maybe it's a non-issue. |
| 15:12 |
kmlussier |
jihpringle: Ah, ok. Thanks. |
| 15:12 |
jihpringle |
I think the only PO charges we've tested recently are for blanket orders and those are working (but aren't prorated |
| 15:13 |
* kmlussier |
nods |
| 15:13 |
kmlussier |
I may dig further, but since it appears to be a preexisting condition, I think the current fix is good to go in. |
| 15:15 |
Christineb |
kmlussier++ |
| 15:15 |
Christineb |
Thank you for testing! |
| 15:16 |
kmlussier |
Christineb++ #Thanks for finding the problem before our libraries upgraded to 2.10! |
| 15:17 |
jihpringle |
kmlussier: I though there was a direct charge/po related bug on launchpad but I couldn't find it |
| 15:17 |
kmlussier |
Oh, you know what? I bet you the problem on the PO occurs for the same reason it was happening on the invoice. Because the charges on the PO are encumbered. |
| 15:18 |
kmlussier |
jihpringle: There is one. I had it up a minute ago. Hold on... |
| 15:19 |
kmlussier |
bug 1272515 |
| 15:19 |
pinesol_green |
Launchpad bug 1272515 in Evergreen "Acq: Charges added to Purchase Orders are not transferring to Invoices" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1272515 |
| 15:20 |
jihpringle |
that'll be the one I was thinking of |
| 16:16 |
StomproJ |
Bmagic, thanks for the tip, I was planning on exluding any part used in a hold when deleting so I think that will take care of that. (as shown in tsbere's parts cleanup code). |
| 16:35 |
Bmagic |
StomproJ - no problem, if you have that already in your equation, then I think you are good. I have played with this myself a fair amount. |
| 16:36 |
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| 17:31 |
kmlussier |
@quote random |
| 17:32 |
pinesol_green |
kmlussier: Quote #82: "< jeff> evergreen 2.next will eliminate search path issues. it will also bake you a cake." (added by csharp at 09:08 PM, April 08, 2014) |
| 17:32 |
kmlussier |
mmmm...cake |
| 17:33 |
kmlussier |
@dessert [someone] |
| 17:33 |
* pinesol_green |
grabs some Tiramisu for jeffdavis |
| 17:33 |
jeffdavis |
yum! |
| 18:05 |
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| 21:44 |
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| 22:10 |
pinesol_green |
[evergreen|Jeff Davis] LP#1589586: use all fund debits (even encumbrances) when doing prorate calculations - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=8b77b68> |
| 23:07 |
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