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IRC log for #evergreen, 2015-06-01

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Time Nick Message
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06:27 devi_ hello
06:27 devi_ I have, barcode, cat, cn, marc - csv format files to import to Evergreen
06:27 devi_ how?
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09:03 dbs Dyrcona++ # sorry I couldn't make the RM election meeting
09:32 kmlussier devi_: Did you try following the instructions at the link we sent you last week? http://docs.evergreen-ils.org/2.8/_​migrating_from_a_legacy_system.html
09:39 kmlussier http://docs.evergreen-ils.org/2.8/_​migrating_from_a_legacy_system.html
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09:42 bshum devi_: Out of curiosity, what legacy system are you attempting to migrate from?
09:43 devi_ omg....there is no word about CSV files.....
09:43 kmlussier devi_: You can't migrate CSV files. They have to be MARC files.
09:44 Dyrcona kmlussier: I've done migrations where patron data and transactions were in CSV. Bib records work best in MARC.
09:44 bshum jeff++ # yeah, that's applicable for VMs in certain hosted environments, right? Like Amazon cloud?
09:44 Dyrcona Granted, I write my own software each time to load the data.
09:45 Dyrcona Which reminds me.....I owe someone some questions about a migration.
09:45 kmlussier OK, sorry, I was focusing on the bib data.
09:45 devi_ documentation sucks
09:45 devi_ :-(
09:46 Dyrcona The migration documentation is lacking, 'cause there are way too many variables.
09:46 devi_ but everything goes to console and crappy perls sripts :-)
09:47 Dyrcona That's how it usually works with large database applications, not just ILS.
09:51 bshum devi_: Frustrating as it might initially appear, I might appreciate it more if you'd be a little considerate of others in this community of volunteers who participated in the creation of the docs and scripts.
09:52 bshum We do try to help out where best we can.
09:52 devi_ ტჰანკ ყოუ
09:52 devi_ thank you
09:52 devi_ bye
09:52 bshum And there are actual support companies who do provide Evergreen migration services.
09:52 bshum But alrighty then.
09:53 * csharp was about to suggest Evergreen Migration Assistant Pro™
09:55 csharp seriously, though - there couldn't really be a standardized migration tool - as Dyrcona says, each one is different ;-)
09:56 Dyrcona Everyone that I have done has been different, even when data was in the same format.
09:56 Dyrcona You often run into things that one library did with their system that the other one didn't.
09:57 csharp exactly
10:02 Bmagic he seemed mad
10:02 jboyer-isl Methinks his sadness at everything going to the console means that there is no answer they would find acceptable. If one of you has time to build a universal data massager that can accept csv, xlsx, .prn, .txt, .mrc and so on and just "Make it Work" I'm sure it would be appreciated.
10:03 jboyer-isl I'm just a little too busy to build it myself. I'm sure it's not that hard.
10:03 Bmagic I was working on a UI for migration last year
10:03 csharp heh
10:03 Dyrcona Nothing $100 million can't solve.
10:03 bshum Well, Bmagic has magic. So I believe in you.
10:03 bshum Bmagic++
10:03 Bmagic haha!
10:04 jboyer-isl 1 Million to buy ads in library pubs saying "Migs are hard! Sorry." and 99 Million for retirement. This is a sound plan.
10:04 RoganH Dyrcona: you haven't created an AI that anticipates every ILS's structure for migrations yet?
10:04 csharp Webby the Migration Duck
10:05 Dyrcona heh
10:05 csharp "If anyone knows about migrations, it's us Ducks!"
10:06 kmlussier Yeah, he seemed mad, but I'm glad bshum said something. I think it's important people know that we don't necessarily condone the practice of saying somebody else's work sucks.
10:06 kmlussier bshum++
10:10 csharp it's a super common reponse from people who are used to proprietary programs with slick GUIs
10:10 csharp when they don't see what they're expecting, they draw a lot of erroneous conclusions ;-)
10:11 RoganH csharp: though said proprietary programs with slick GUIs don't have built in tools to migrate any form of data into their native needs either
10:11 csharp a response to F/LOSS
10:11 csharp RoganH: you're exactly right ;-)
10:11 Dyrcona What RoganH said.
10:12 RoganH slick guis are overrated, they're slow and cumbersome for detailed work anyway
10:13 Dyrcona Most guis are designed for direct manipulation.
10:14 Dyrcona i.e. working on one "thing" at a time.
10:16 RoganH one thing with a limited set of variables associated that can be presented visually without interfering with each other.  There are neat tricks that help with dynamic interfaces but GUIs still struggle with some limits.
10:19 Dyrcona Well, today's GUIs are basically paintings on the walls of caves.
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10:21 Dyrcona Helps to get the branch name correct when trying to merge. :)
10:26 Dyrcona Helps to rebase old stuff now and then, too.
10:34 Dyrcona csharp: working/user/csharp/lp1444623-remove​-Safe-CPAN-dependency-from-Makefiles needs a rebase.
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10:59 csharp Dyrcona: done
10:59 Dyrcona csharp++
11:05 Dyrcona Whee! On floppy per second throughput: Writing objects: 100% (220823/220823), 100.81 MiB | 1.44 MiB/s, done.
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11:13 jeff now i want to make some videos visualizing throughput of various things using various other things.
11:14 jeff probably already been done, but that should not prevent me from at some point in the future involving a belt sander to feed a stack of floppies at an appropriate rate across the room.
11:16 tsbere jeff: I have seen videos showing the "truck full of tapes" method as a comparison point....including more modern variants. Like "truck full of microsd cards".
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11:47 roger_skip Help! I foolishly changed my hostname after I finished the server setup. Now ejabberd hates me.
11:48 bshum Oops, totally fixable.
11:49 bshum roger_skip: So I'm going to refer you to jeff's suggestions from past IRC conversations on this subject area: http://irc.evergreen-ils.org/​evergreen/2014-09-24#i_126336
11:50 bshum roger_skip: But tell us more about your setup and maybe we can offer newer suggestions.
11:51 roger_skip Ok. Installed 2.8.1 on Ubuntu Trusty
11:52 roger_skip One server, no clients set up yet
11:53 bshum So yeah, removing ejabberd's data and then re-registering your ejabberd clients will allow things to go back to normal after a hostname change.
11:54 bshum If you think the hostname will alter again, doing what jeff suggests and changing the erlang_node will keep it from needing further change.
11:54 roger_skip Great! I'll give it a try. Thank you :)
12:04 bshum roger_skip: Hope it all works out, good luck!
12:13 bshum ldw: jeffdavis: Question, did Christine's slides for the Overdrive API integration that she showed us at the lightning talk ever make it online somewhere?
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12:27 bshum @hate SIP2
12:27 pinesol_green bshum: The operation succeeded.  bshum hates SIP2.
12:29 jboyer-isl I'll stand up for SIP, in it's intended use case, that is. It's a fine protocol for point to point serial connections. It is garbage for the wild, wild, winternet.
12:30 jboyer-isl turns out: commas, also garbage.
12:30 bshum Heh
12:30 bshum I'm just figuring out some email question about SIP2 patron information responses.
12:30 bshum Trying to figure out what all the fields mean, whee
12:31 eeevil bshum: haha ... you said "mean" ;)
12:31 bshum Heh
12:31 jboyer-isl I wouldn't know anything about any pdfs marked 3M confidential, but I hear Google knows how to find some documentation that may help. ;(
12:31 jboyer-isl ;)
12:31 berick heh
12:31 bshum jboyer-isl: Right, and I know there's a wiki page with some thoughts
12:31 bshum Like http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?id=ev​ergreen-admin:sip_support#patron_information
12:31 bshum It's really old, but sometimes I find helpful tidbits.
12:32 * berick recommends the same 3M document.. which i have never seen
12:33 RoganH I've read the document.  It diverges from implementations about as far as you'd think it would.
12:33 jeff i appreciated the reaction i got when i started to implement fine details using the 3M doc -- they were shocked, and stated that their software didn't support that level of detail, because no ILS did.
12:34 berick if you write the docs, they will come... and want more docs
12:36 jboyer-isl It looks like the version that Google now finds lacks any limits on distribution (but you can't create derivative protocols, "darn") so that's where you want to start if you just want "what's this field?" info.
12:38 jeff look, ma! webhooks-over-email!
12:39 jeff (set up an A/T event def to send an email to a fixed address containing just a hold ID when holds go to Available)
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13:05 Dyrcona Step 5 of the websockets setup in the OpenSRF README is missing some information that will trip up newbies.
13:06 Dyrcona It should tell them to cd to the OpenSRF code before running the copy commands.
13:06 Dyrcona Someone just blindly copying and pasting commands will get errors.
13:06 bshum Dyrcona: I thought of that too when I worked on the OpenSRF steps.
13:07 bshum I was thinking at some point to change OpenSRF's README style to be more like Evergreen's, and offer general tips on things like source_dir, etc.
13:07 bshum But didn't get around to it, obviously.
13:07 bshum :|
13:09 ohiojoe I saw a couple of places over the weekend where I thought the OpenSRF fresh install docs could use a little expansion for the sake of newbies..
13:11 ohiojoe I was documenting these in a word document that may or may not be lost..  my Windows installation decided to lockup overnight..
13:14 ohiojoe Which reminds me, it looks like Debian has moved their backports repo for Wheezy and Jessie to a new URL and slightly different format
13:16 ohiojoe I have to admit, I'm new to being more than just a user in the EG community, how or to whom should I address documentiation suggestions?
13:16 kmlussier ohiojoe: You could send them to the documentation list.
13:17 ohiojoe ok, thanks.
13:23 Dyrcona You could also open a launchpad bug and tag it documentation.
13:24 ohiojoe mm, that would have the added benefit of providing practice for using launchpad...
13:27 Dyrcona Speaking of documentation, I can't seem to find the Evergreen instructions for the web staff client setup.
13:28 Dyrcona Oh, wait. Just found 'em. ;)
13:28 csharp argh - I'm really confusing myself - I'm trying to "reset" some failed Acq PO A/T events and get the edi_pusher.pl script to care about them
13:29 csharp I reset the A/T events with 'update action_trigger.event set start_time = null, update_time = null, complete_time = null, state = 'pending' where id in (list of at.event ids);' but the pusher doesn't "see" them
13:31 bshum Dyrcona: Yeah that needs to get LP'd at some point too... and I should finish putting more notes into it.
13:31 bshum But I think other people should try it out and confirm the process and maybe add better notes than what I've done.  I think my perspective isn't good enough on its own anymore.
13:31 Dyrcona bshum: I wanted to ask you about the note on 4 about skipping the step if you downloaded a tarball.
13:32 bshum Dyrcona: For Evergreen tarballs, from 2.7+ the web client code is compiled automagically via a flag passed to the make_release script
13:32 Dyrcona bshum: OK. I did not know that.
13:32 Dyrcona Guess it is a good thing that I do now. :)
13:32 bshum So for downloaded tarballs, the web client code is all set, and you don't have to install the pre-req's, etc.
13:33 bshum For compiling it
13:33 bshum 2.7 and 2.8 RMs just have to remember to pass that flag along.  Guess you'll know too ;)
13:33 bshum The flag is -c
13:34 bshum Dyrcona: You should bookmark this wiki page:  http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php​?id=dev:release_process:evergreen:2.8
13:34 bshum It's a good workflow of how releases are done
13:34 bshum More recently anyways.
13:35 Dyrcona bshum: Thanks, I already have that page bookmarked, just haven't given it the attention it deserves, yet.
13:41 Dyrcona I am tempted to try the latest tag in Node.js: 0.12.4.
13:43 csharp I also noticed a possible "retry" status on the acq.edi_message table, and set that for the messages I'm trying to re-send, but that's not working either :-/
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13:56 Dyrcona Hmm. That second npm install still fails for me unless I do it with sudo.
13:56 Dyrcona I also get several warnings.
13:56 * jeff refreshes his memory on what kinds of things can key a template dir change
14:00 Dyrcona Ah. I figured out the sudo bit.
14:02 Dyrcona So, where and when are the steps in 4.2 supposed to happen?
14:03 Dyrcona Are they meant to be done during the normal installation steps before building and installing a regular staff client?
14:03 Dyrcona Or can they be done in /openils/var/web/js/ui/default/staff after the regular installation?
14:03 Dyrcona Doing it in the latter place fails for me on grunt all.
14:06 dbs packages of packages of packages, whee :)
14:07 Dyrcona heh
14:08 Dyrcona Well, I guess I'll find out if I've had success after the database upgrade scripts finish.
14:08 Dyrcona I should have started that before embarking on the web staff client steps.
14:10 Dyrcona FTL: It looks like the steps are meant to come in the normal installation procedure and are meant to be run in your source checkout/exploded tarball.
14:10 bshum Right.
14:10 Dyrcona That is, before make install is run.
14:10 bshum Yes.
14:10 bshum From source directory.
14:10 bshum Not installed place
14:31 berick in the release builder, we delete the node_modules and bower_modules directories before tar'ing the build.  you may want do to the same before 'make install'  (or maybe move them somewhere else).
14:31 berick otherwise make install copies them to the web dir
14:31 berick which is just an extra pile of stuff that does not need to go there
14:33 berick still some rough edges, obviously
14:33 Dyrcona yep.
14:33 Dyrcona I'll just delete them for now.
14:34 Dyrcona bower_modules or bower_components? I have the latter and not the former.
14:34 berick bower_components, then
14:34 berick i forget exactly
14:35 Dyrcona S'all right. I can always copy them back if it turns out I need it.
14:37 hopkinsju bshum++ (from earlier)
14:38 Dyrcona csharp: Have you had any luck with your acq problem? I have no idea how to help, but wonder if you have made any progress.
14:40 csharp Dyrcona: thanks for asking - no - no further progress - my next step is to trace the thread from the pusher script back to the whole PO activation process
14:41 csharp I'm hurting because I have limited knowledge of the actual process
14:41 csharp (that is, the process that staff perform to enter orders and place them)
14:44 Dyrcona csharp: same here. I also don't know the code well at all.
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15:04 krvmga i'm a little confused. when exactly does autogen need to be run when we make changes?
15:09 csharp krvmga: basically, if you alter the org tree by adding a branch, making something OPAC visible/invisible, or changing the parent org or something like that, run autogen on anything running Evergreen
15:09 bshum And reload/restart apache.
15:09 csharp (that is to say, don't forget about utility servers and such, especially ones processing holds)
15:10 krvmga thanks! :)
15:10 ldw bshum: Here is a link to Christine's slide: https://docs.google.com/presentatio​n/d/1zQrPOn4W3v31OvyTHhb5cUDJZYacE4​wiOcsTZy7_erk/edit?pli=1#slide=id.p4
15:11 bshum ldw: Awesome!  Thanks for sharing
15:11 krvmga also, i discovered this http://support.esilibrary.com/index.p​hp?pg=kb.printer.friendly&id=2#p8 which has a section on when to run autogen.
15:21 ohiojoe ok, question about hostnames..  if does it matter, in term of achieving a working installation, what host names I use for public.localhost and private.localhost for the opensrf domains?
15:21 ohiojoe For instance, can I just call it public.localhost and private.localhost?  Or does that create known issues?
15:22 Dyrcona krvmga leaves too soon. You also need to run autogen.sh if you change the IDL.
15:22 ohiojoe when working through installing opensrf, I should mention
15:23 bshum ohiojoe: It doesn't really matter what you name those particular entries.  The reason those are written as such is to allow for the possibility that ejabberd doesn't live on the same place you end up installing and running OpenSRF/Evergreen.  That allows for more distributed nature of building an Evergreen cluster as it were.
15:24 Dyrcona ohiojoe: I don't think so. I call mine public.{hostname} and private.{hostname} in my /etc/hosts.
15:24 bshum ohiojoe: The sample instruction is just there to give you an example.
15:25 Dyrcona So, I got the web staff client installed, but when I go to login, clicking on the Sign In button appears to do nothing.
15:25 ohiojoe ok, cool, thanks.
15:25 bshum ohiojoe: The main idea in most cases I've seen where people construct an Evergreen "brick" whereby a single lead server runs apache/ejabberd, etc. and other serving drone servers provide specific open-ils services, but communicate using the lead device's ejabberd instance.
15:25 jeff Dyrcona: page loaded via https? websockets apache instance started without issue, and using a "real" ssl cert? checked browser console for errors?
15:25 bshum Real SSL cert tends to be a common quirk.
15:26 Dyrcona jeff: check on the first three.
15:26 Dyrcona I think this is my problem: Firefox can't establish a connection to the server at wss://jasondev.mvlcstaff.org:7​682/osrf-websocket-translator.
15:27 bshum Dyrcona: Is the websockets instance configured to use a proper SSL cert?  (aka, did websockets even start on the server?).  Or maybe firewall?
15:27 * bshum would like it better if the apache-websockets instance logged somewhere with more detail when it fails to start properly.
15:27 * bshum has found that to be entertaining from time to time figuring out why it doesn't start.
15:28 jeff yeah, looks like a timeout on that port. host or network based firewall blackhole?
15:28 jeff of course, my source ip is not your source ip...
15:29 Dyrcona I need to fix the ssl configuration for the web sockets apache, apparently.
15:31 bshum Dyrcona: Yeah the default path assumes that you copy the ssl folder to the apache-websockets dir too.  Or change it to /etc/apache/ssl/*
15:32 Dyrcona bshum: That wasn't my problem. We also don't use the default names of server.* and we need the Godaddy chain file.
15:32 bshum Sure.
15:32 Dyrcona But, fixing that, I still get no connection.
15:32 Dyrcona Guess I'll check the firewall, next.
15:33 Dyrcona Not sure if it sees me by my internal or external IP, and it may not matter depending on what we've done to the firewall.
15:34 Dyrcona So, looks like it uses ports 7680 and 7682.
15:34 bshum Primarily 7682 for https if memory serves
15:38 Dyrcona Changing the firewall didn't help.
15:41 Dyrcona Is there more configuration that needs to be done for web sockets?
15:41 * berick confirms we're not actually using 7680
15:42 berick Dyrcona: on ubuntu 14.04 i've been having trouble lately starting / restarting apache-websockets via "service apache2-websockets restart" and similar
15:42 Dyrcona berick: I did /etc/init.d/apache2-websockets
15:42 berick /etc/init.d/.. restart no good either.  had to use apache2ctl-websockets restart
15:43 Dyrcona Gotta love this:
15:43 Dyrcona opensrf@jasondev:~$ sudo apache2ctl-websockets restart
15:43 Dyrcona [sudo] password for opensrf:
15:43 Dyrcona httpd not running, trying to start
15:43 Dyrcona opensrf@jasondev:~$ sudo apache2ctl-websockets start
15:43 Dyrcona httpd (pid 10774) already running
15:44 Dyrcona Oops. I thought it was telling me to start it.
15:45 Dyrcona berick++
15:45 Dyrcona It is working, now.
15:45 berick excellent
15:45 * berick was hoping that was a bit of local funkiness :(
15:45 berick fwiw, never had that problem on wheezy
15:48 Dyrcona berick: The patron registration phase1 looks usable. I assume there is no code behind it?
15:49 berick Dyrcona: well, there is a lot of code behind it, but none that sends changes back to the server.
15:49 berick it's just fetching data and display stuff for now
15:49 Dyrcona berick: heh. that's what I meant.
15:50 berick i know :)
15:52 Dyrcona :)
15:52 Dyrcona A song that seems appropriate for the moment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSbBvKaM6sk
15:54 berick :)
15:57 Dyrcona Guess collum is not a fan of Damon Albarn... ;)
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16:11 RoganH lol
16:26 ohiojoe I just figured out what I was doing wrong with ejabberd..   I needed to start (restart) ejabberdctl before registering the public and private jabber users..
16:26 Bmagic ohiojoe: Oh man, I was going to suggest that!
16:27 ohiojoe at least that solved the problem on the new VM I just started this afternoon..
16:27 ohiojoe although on the VM at home, I followed the same process as I did today, except today's was uncluttered by my early attempts to solve the ejabberd issues..
16:30 ohiojoe I now wonder whether I should press on, or look through the IRC log from 9/24/14 that was referenced earlier today and harden my install to insure that jabber doesn't get bent out of shape when the server IP changes...
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16:59 * Dyrcona feels a blog post coming on.
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17:09 pinesol_green Incoming from qatests: Test Success - http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live/test.html <http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live/test.html>
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