| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:13 |
jeff |
one down: bug 1297614 |
| 00:13 |
pinesol_green |
Launchpad bug 1297614 in Evergreen "Add support for Syndetics Plus" (affected: 1, heat: 6) [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1297614 - Assigned to Jeff Godin (jgodin) |
| 01:09 |
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| 07:48 |
csharp |
@later tell rfrasur no - I had Saturday evening -> Monday morning at home and drove to Raleigh on Monday morning |
| 07:48 |
pinesol_green |
csharp: The operation succeeded. |
| 07:55 |
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| 08:12 |
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| 08:18 |
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| 08:22 |
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| 08:28 |
csharp |
jeff: I finally installed Business::Stripe on the Ubuntu buildslave, FYI |
| 08:29 |
csharp |
so both GPLS slaves are updated |
| 08:31 |
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| 08:31 |
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| 08:33 |
bshum |
csharp++ |
| 08:34 |
jeff |
csharp: thanks! |
| 08:34 |
jeff |
csharp: i'm likely to be hacking on Syndetics Plus support today. Updates will go in the bug I opened last night. |
| 08:39 |
csharp |
jeff: excellent |
| 08:40 |
* csharp |
looks forward to getting past the busy travel season and able to work on projects again |
| 08:40 |
jeff |
yeah. |
| 08:41 |
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| 08:42 |
_bott_ |
Some morning frivolity http://cdn.themetapicture.com/media/funny-Grumpy-cat-programmer-code-bugs.jpg |
| 08:55 |
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| 08:59 |
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| 09:04 |
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| 09:12 |
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| 09:23 |
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| 09:32 |
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| 09:42 |
jeff |
morning, all! |
| 09:44 |
remingtron |
hi jeff |
| 09:44 |
remingtron |
I'm learning about BIBFRAME, have you or your librarians investigated it at all? |
| 09:45 |
jeff |
I have an awareness of it, but could not claim to even be able to give an elevator pitch on it. I'm on the list, and peek in from time to time. |
| 09:46 |
* Dyrcona |
points at open-ils-general, but thinks remingtron has already seen the emails. |
| 09:46 |
remingtron |
Sounds like something the EG community should keep an eye on. Thanks Dyrcona, yes that is what spurred my interest. |
| 09:46 |
jcamins |
jeff: I always use the following to explain it: "WE'RE DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMEEEEDDD." |
| 09:47 |
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| 09:47 |
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| 09:51 |
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| 09:51 |
bshum |
Well, the only other email about bibframe was a forward by ehardy back in November 2011. So, I guess there's not alot of motion on it presently? :D |
| 09:51 |
jeff |
puppet chef ansible salt... or just shell scripts. :-) |
| 09:52 |
jeff |
short story character name: Ansible Salt |
| 09:53 |
jeff |
(his parents were sysadmins back before the reset) |
| 09:54 |
Dyrcona |
jcamins: That explains just about everything. |
| 09:55 |
jcamins |
Dyrcona: I like multi-purpose explanations. |
| 09:55 |
Dyrcona |
jcamins++ |
| 09:56 |
yboston |
Question about EG community calendar(s)…. I would like to list the Thursday IRC practice time on one of the cakendars... |
| 09:56 |
yboston |
but I only have access to the DIG calendar. I can add it there, but wondering if it should be added on a different one |
| 09:57 |
bshum |
yboston: Some of us have powers to add others to the community calendar |
| 09:57 |
bshum |
I can add you to that |
| 09:57 |
yboston |
bshum: OK, thanks |
| 09:58 |
bshum |
yboston: You should have powers now. |
| 09:58 |
* dbs |
has followed the bibframe mailing list, concurs with jcamins |
| 09:59 |
jcamins |
I thought about joining the bibframe list. Then my survival instinct kicked in. |
| 10:00 |
csharp |
jcamins++ |
| 10:01 |
yboston |
bshum: ¡gracias! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jnv0ejmLlY |
| 10:14 |
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| 10:18 |
pinesol_green |
[evergreen|Jason Stephenson] LP1297435: Make 0872 upgrade require less hand holding. - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=2d2e504> |
| 10:24 |
egbuilder |
build #573 of evergreen-master-ubuntu-12.04-x86 is complete: Success [build successful] Build details are at http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/buildbot/builders/evergreen-master-ubuntu-12.04-x86/builds/573 |
| 10:25 |
bshum |
Yay! |
| 10:25 |
bshum |
:) |
| 10:25 |
bshum |
(unrelated) |
| 10:30 |
csharp |
buildbot++ |
| 10:31 |
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| 10:39 |
* jeff |
starts the opensrf-slave slave also |
| 10:39 |
jeff |
apologies, as i think it's going to build a few times and report here. :-) |
| 10:41 |
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hopkinsju joined #evergreen |
| 10:42 |
hopkinsju |
Bmagic++ |
| 10:42 |
Bmagic |
hopkinsju++ |
| 10:42 |
* hopkinsju |
basks in the warm glow of the new quassel core |
| 10:43 |
bshum |
Fancy :) |
| 10:43 |
bshum |
quassel++ |
| 10:46 |
hopkinsju |
IKR? I know it's been said before (including by me) that a community Quassel core would be awesome. I wonder what the RAM/CPU/network requirements of such a thing would be. |
| 10:47 |
* bshum |
bans kmlussier from said future quassel server till we solve her weird Windows quirks. |
| 10:49 |
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StephenGWills joined #evergreen |
| 10:51 |
kmlussier |
:9 |
| 10:51 |
kmlussier |
:( |
| 10:54 |
* Bmagic |
recommends this command: format c: /quick |
| 10:56 |
eeevil |
Bmagic: have a heart and at least add /system to make it bootable ;) |
| 10:57 |
Bmagic |
eeevil: lol - yeah bootable suuuure |
| 10:58 |
phasefx |
new meaning to DOS |
| 10:58 |
jeffdavis |
rangi: what is the state of the NCIPServer code? I see it's being actively developed (which is great!), wondering how far it is from being ready for testing/release. |
| 11:01 |
Dyrcona |
jeffdavis: My understanding is testing is started for the Koha side of things. The Evergreen side has gone nowhere because I was going to do it and have been too busy with other projects. |
| 11:01 |
jeff |
jeffdavis: what are you looking to do with NCIP? |
| 11:02 |
Dyrcona |
jeffdavis: The Evergreen side of things should start moving within a few weeks or months. |
| 11:09 |
jl- |
I'm reporting on the conference later today, anyone else want to chime in why migrating from a legacy ILS -> evergreen is such a big deal? so far I have: 1) marc records are shit 2) there are a lot of custom scripts involved but no clear documentation that fits all for batch importing formatting, adjusting (utilizing and perl, python) and there are several layers to be aware of (bibs, authorities, holds, books in circulation, charactor en |
| 11:09 |
jl- |
the list could probably go on and on but I need to make a good assessment of the effort it will take |
| 11:10 |
jl- |
that being said I've been able to import ~100k records at a time but for some record sets it chokes |
| 11:10 |
Dyrcona |
jl-: There are many different ILS out there so a script that works with data from one, might not work with data from another. |
| 11:10 |
jl- |
indeed |
| 11:10 |
jeff |
jl-: your list truncated at "character enc" |
| 11:11 |
Dyrcona |
jl-: Also, not everyone on the same ILS uses the same features or uses them the same way, so a script for one ILS might not work all customers. |
| 11:11 |
jl- |
jeff: I also had previous ILS tags |
| 11:11 |
jl- |
Dyrcona: yeah that makes sense.. the transformation change is big, I want to talk about the technical implications |
| 11:11 |
Dyrcona |
s/(work) (all)/\1 for \2/ |
| 11:11 |
jl- |
*transformational |
| 11:16 |
jl- |
hm |
| 11:17 |
jeff |
since quassel has come up in conversation here a bit -- what are OS X users using in terms of a client? Are you using Quassel IRC Client v0.9.2, or something else? |
| 11:18 |
bshum |
jeff: That sounds like the one I was using on my macbook the last time I pulled it out of the stack of discarded laptops. |
| 11:18 |
* gmcharlt |
uses Quassel 0.8.0 on my OS X laptop |
| 11:18 |
bshum |
That's the precompiled one that's linked on the quassel page right? |
| 11:18 |
* gmcharlt |
probably shoudl upgrade as well |
| 11:18 |
jl- |
I use irssi from any shell |
| 11:19 |
csharp |
irssi + screen FTW |
| 11:19 |
jl- |
it also blends in better with your work environment if you set it to /set theme.colorless |
| 11:19 |
csharp |
old_skool++ |
| 11:19 |
jl- |
looks like you are just in a shell then |
| 11:19 |
jl- |
;) |
| 11:19 |
jeff |
gmcharlt: beware, i found that 0.9.2 doesn't seem to auto-reconnect after network loss (or sleep/wake) |
| 11:20 |
bshum |
Bleh |
| 11:20 |
jeff |
it's annoying, but i'm usually using {mosh|ssh}+{tmux|screen}+irssi anyway. |
| 11:20 |
jl- |
/SET theme colorless.theme |
| 11:20 |
gmcharlt |
hopkinsju: re a community Quassel core -- one consideration: Quassel logs /everything/ by default |
| 11:20 |
csharp |
mosh++ jeff++ |
| 11:21 |
csharp |
gonna set that up on all my oft-used servers |
| 11:21 |
gmcharlt |
it's not that I don't trust you all, but I personally would never use an IRC bouncer that wasn't under my control |
| 11:21 |
gmcharlt |
jeff: good to know |
| 11:21 |
jeff |
which would mean that those using the code would be trusting those administering the core with all of their irc traffic, including nickserv and bot passwords as well as private messages. |
| 11:22 |
jeff |
csharp: mosh is present on lupin, courtesy backports. |
| 11:22 |
csharp |
jeff: yes, excellent |
| 11:23 |
jl- |
my bouncer is running from my ddwrt router |
| 11:23 |
jl- |
called miau |
| 11:25 |
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| 11:26 |
jeff |
rfrasur++ for the quote "I am, however, interested to see if this is an actual thing or just another library idea that ends up being a pain with little added value." |
| 11:26 |
rfrasur |
hey, yo, thanks :) |
| 11:26 |
rfrasur |
hmmm, and yeah...I do actually say that irl |
| 11:26 |
* rfrasur |
is ashamed again |
| 11:27 |
jeff |
ashamed? |
| 11:27 |
rfrasur |
Actually, I feel like I should go back to library school and learn more about cataloging |
| 11:28 |
rfrasur |
yes...I'm ashamed that I say "hey...yo...thanks" in actual conversation. |
| 11:28 |
Dyrcona |
rfrasur: That's cool. bro.... |
| 11:28 |
Dyrcona |
:) |
| 11:28 |
rfrasur |
Dyrcona++ |
| 11:29 |
rfrasur |
csharp:That's good. |
| 11:29 |
* gmcharlt |
blames graced for adding "groovy" back to his vocabulary |
| 11:29 |
rfrasur |
gmcharlt: you'd removed it? |
| 11:29 |
gmcharlt |
rfrasur: it had fallen into disuse |
| 11:30 |
rfrasur |
I'm glad it found a second life :D |
| 11:32 |
jeff |
grumbly again that Syndetics some of their formatting issues, but only for Syndetics Plus -- not in the HTML or XML views of their data. |
| 11:32 |
jeff |
s/some of/fixed some of/ # i accidentally the word "fixed", there. |
| 11:33 |
rfrasur |
lol, yikes |
| 11:34 |
rfrasur |
Hmm, so you'll pay them for syndetics plus, you think? |
| 11:34 |
jeffdavis |
Dyrcona: not looking to do anything with NCIP right now, just need to tell my boss where it's at :) |
| 11:35 |
jeffdavis |
thanks! |
| 11:35 |
jeff |
Syndetics Plus is just an alternate (javascript-requiring, not previously supported at all on secure sites) method of accessing the Syndetics content you already pay for. |
| 11:35 |
jeff |
jeffdavis: what is your boss looking to do with NCIP? :-) |
| 11:35 |
rfrasur |
jeff: oh (see? I do need to go back to school) |
| 11:36 |
jeff |
nah, it sounds like something that you'd need to pay extra for. :-) |
| 11:36 |
csharp |
"with Syndetics Plus you actually get to use everything you pay for with regular Syndetics!" |
| 11:36 |
Dyrcona |
too_many_browser_tabs_open-- |
| 11:36 |
jeffdavis |
jeff: answering an RFEOI ;) |
| 11:36 |
rfrasur |
lol, csharp...that sounds like a terrible selling point all around. |
| 11:37 |
jeff |
csharp: to the best of my knowledge, there are no data elements available only in Syndetics Plus and not available in the HTML and XML feeds. |
| 11:37 |
jeff |
(unless you count paragraph breaks :P) |
| 11:37 |
csharp |
jeff: nah - I'm just kidding ;-) |
| 11:37 |
csharp |
csharp-- |
| 11:37 |
rfrasur |
stop that |
| 11:37 |
rfrasur |
csharp++ |
| 11:37 |
rfrasur |
I think Evergreen Indiana is looking at going with NoveList to replace Syndetics. |
| 11:38 |
rfrasur |
but it costs a.....lot. |
| 11:38 |
csharp |
rfrasur: PINES is looking at adding NoveList alongside existing Syndetics services |
| 11:38 |
Dyrcona |
We have Syndetics for the consortium and Novelist for some (all?) of our members. |
| 11:38 |
jeff |
The handful of libraries I've talked with who add Novelist still keep Syndetics for cover/jacket images. |
| 11:38 |
dbs |
jeff: lack of context but buildbot only announces changes in build status (e.g. from failed -> success) |
| 11:38 |
bshum |
We have Syndetics for all, and Novelist for a handful (like four or so libs) |
| 11:38 |
jeffdavis |
jeff: less glibly, we don't have a use case for NCIP right now, just need to explain what EG can do and what it will be able to do in the near future. |
| 11:38 |
csharp |
jeff: exactly |
| 11:38 |
jeff |
dbs: ah! thanks! |
| 11:39 |
jeff |
dbs: logical! |
| 11:39 |
rfrasur |
That's interesting. I don't know if we're talking about replacing or adding now that you bring it up. |
| 11:39 |
* rfrasur |
isn't sure if she's supposed to talk about it either. |
| 11:39 |
jeff |
jeffdavis: certainly! i've some interest in NCIP since we're using it with our state ILL system, so I tend to poke and prod when it comes up. |
| 11:39 |
* rfrasur |
barely cares. |
| 11:41 |
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| 11:43 |
rfrasur |
So, I had a couple thoughts that aren't development related but are Evergreen related (well, not overtly development...I guess). 1. It'd be cool to have an administrative interest group....or something...in the community. 2. It'd be cool if, after conference sites are determined, local/regional software dev university programs were identified and then invited to a special welcome/information session to talk about F/OSS |
| 11:43 |
rfrasur |
and also Evergreen. |
| 11:43 |
jeff |
administrative interest group in the sense of "library directors" and such? |
| 11:43 |
jeff |
idea 2 sounds very interesting! |
| 11:43 |
jeff |
rfrasur++ |
| 11:44 |
rfrasur |
jeff: yeah, though a little broader than that. library directors, but also consortium personnel, etc. |
| 11:44 |
jeff |
yep. |
| 11:44 |
rfrasur |
That's it. I haven't thought about either one any more than that. |
| 11:45 |
* rfrasur |
has been singing Sandra Boynton's "Chocolate Chip Cookies" song to preschoolers. |
| 11:47 |
csharp |
aversion to IRC/email lists seem to be a barrier with those types of staff |
| 11:48 |
rfrasur |
Yeah...have kinda noticed. I think addressing that is probably one of the first steps. Will spend some car time thinking about it. |
| 11:49 |
* csharp |
has seen more comfort with the "regular traditional conference calls" approach |
| 11:49 |
* bshum |
seems to think of all sorts of things when driving around places. |
| 11:49 |
* rfrasur |
growls "I HATE conference calls so very, VERY much." |
| 11:49 |
csharp |
lack of public logs considered in that |
| 11:50 |
rfrasur |
Yeah, it'd really need to be logged. |
| 11:51 |
* Dyrcona |
dies a little inside. |
| 11:51 |
Dyrcona |
Not related to anything in the channel...just work. |
| 11:51 |
rfrasur |
Dyrcona: why? because of conference calls? Oh, that's good...although conference calls do evoke a little bit of hari kari in me. |
| 11:55 |
rfrasur |
:-| |
| 11:55 |
* rfrasur |
just died a little, too. |
| 11:59 |
dreuther |
Is there a public facing server running master that I can use to test a couple things? |
| 12:01 |
rfrasur |
dreuther: I'm really not sure. You might want to ping bshum or jeff or csharp or eeevil |
| 12:01 |
* rfrasur |
pings them for you. |
| 12:01 |
dreuther |
rfrasur: Thanks |
| 12:02 |
bshum |
dreuther: So, our production system is a bit dated off master (it's based from November or December I think): acorn.biblio.org |
| 12:02 |
bshum |
But I think my theory server: theory.biblio.org |
| 12:02 |
Dyrcona |
jcamins: [off] None? |
| 12:02 |
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| 12:02 |
bshum |
That should be more recentish |
| 12:03 |
bshum |
And actually master-like |
| 12:03 |
Dyrcona |
oops. bet that's in the logs now. :) |
| 12:04 |
rfrasur |
Dyrcona: no context so it's okay |
| 12:04 |
bshum |
dreuther: I'd generally recommend putting together your own test system though. Trusting the rest of us might not be the best thing if you want to check or poke at things :) |
| 12:04 |
* bshum |
wanders off to lunch |
| 12:05 |
dreuther |
bshum: Thanks I think that will be close enough. Just need a few basic tests. |
| 12:06 |
jeff |
Syndetics Plus adds an additional 13KB of Javascript that rarely if ever changes, yet is loaded with a cache-busting t=Date().getTime() |
| 12:08 |
Dyrcona |
Working for libraries: The crazy that keeps on giving! |
| 12:08 |
jeff |
also, while the http URL is backed by a CDN (which we already know has certain availability issues), the https URL appears to be backed by a single server at proquest. |
| 12:09 |
rfrasur |
Dyrcona: crazy is kind of a requisite for working in a library...but there's crazy...and there's CRAZY. |
| 12:10 |
Dyrcona |
I like to read this blog sometimes: http://www.clerkmanifesto.com/ |
| 12:11 |
jeff |
oh, neat! bare "nbsp; |
| 12:11 |
jeff |
" in the Syndetics Plus content |
| 12:11 |
jeff |
grr. |
| 12:11 |
jeff |
(argh.) |
| 12:12 |
rfrasur |
Dyrcona++ #I'm particularly fond of the "Ten reasons not to read this list of ten reasons not to read this list." |
| 12:19 |
jeff |
<br /> nbsp;<br /> |
| 12:19 |
rfrasur |
lol, nice. |
| 12:23 |
Dyrcona |
rfrasur: I think we need buttons: "I passed the secret test!" |
| 12:23 |
rfrasur |
hehe, I'll make it happen. |
| 12:50 |
* rfrasur |
plays with Awesome Box. |
| 12:56 |
jcamins |
rfrasur: how is it? |
| 12:56 |
rfrasur |
Hmm, not sure yet. Still getting it configured. It seems pretty straightforward though. I'm hoping that it also includes plug-ins or embed code. |
| 12:57 |
jcamins |
rfrasur: greatest straight line ever, and you responded "hmm, not sure yet"? :P |
| 12:57 |
rfrasur |
:p |
| 12:58 |
rfrasur |
Please note that I can only converse intelligently by accident...never on purpose. |
| 12:59 |
rfrasur |
unless it's about Korean chopsticks (pretty intelligent) or yarn (somewhat competent). |
| 13:01 |
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| 13:05 |
rfrasur |
Hmm, it'd be very nice to have EG integration. |
| 13:05 |
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| 13:06 |
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bmills joined #evergreen |
| 13:08 |
Dyrcona |
rfrasur: jeff was looking into that at the confernce, and I also cloned their code repository so I can see how the Awesome Box API works. |
| 13:08 |
Dyrcona |
An "Awesome" checkin modifier should be doable. |
| 13:10 |
rfrasur |
Dyrcona++ jeff++ I don't understand API (I mean, I know generally what it is but that's it), but I think we can hobble along with using ISBN/UPC for the time being. I guess I wouldn't want it tied to one record necessarily, but it'd be a more elegant workflow if my staff could use the ILS only instead of dealing with the AB website as well. |
| 13:11 |
rfrasur |
Not that we have a tremendous amount of volume that'd be particularly burdensome. |
| 13:12 |
hopkinsju |
I'm really liking the idea of an Awesome checkin modifier. |
| 13:14 |
rfrasur |
I'm not sure. You'd need more than one because you can theoretically flag books, videos, and music as awesome...and they'd have different circulation rules that are determined by their modifiers. |
| 13:14 |
rfrasur |
Plus, what's the mechanism to change the modifier? would it happen at checkin? if so, how? |
| 13:15 |
Dyrcona |
rfrasur: The button/menu at the bottom right of the checkin screen. |
| 13:15 |
Dyrcona |
I imagine a workflow where staff checking the awesome box things separately from things from the "regular" box. |
| 13:15 |
Dyrcona |
You'd turn that on, check the materials in, and then hopefully remember to turn the awesome modifier off. |
| 13:16 |
rfrasur |
That makes sense. (btw, I've NEVER used that menu at the bottom...and am now going to, ty) |
| 13:16 |
Dyrcona |
As for different types of materials, that could be handled by the code. It should be able to tell a book from a DVD, for example. |
| 13:17 |
rfrasur |
so, it'd just switch it to an awesome book, dvd, etc....not just to an awesome |
| 13:17 |
hopkinsju |
I guess I should say I'm liking the idea of flagging materials as Awesome in Evergreen in general, not any particular implemtation. |
| 13:17 |
rfrasur |
hopkinsju, depending on how the API functions, it could do some pretty cool stuff. |
| 13:17 |
Dyrcona |
It would send the appropriate information to awesomebox.io, yes. |
| 13:18 |
rfrasur |
which would then send that information to our website...which would, in itself, be awesome. |
| 13:18 |
Dyrcona |
I have not looked at how it could be integrated into the catalog. |
| 13:19 |
Dyrcona |
I imagine awesome box could be an added content provider. |
| 13:19 |
rfrasur |
Yeah |
| 13:20 |
rfrasur |
Okay, I've done my research for today. It works. Next, we need an actual box...and will go from there. |
| 13:20 |
bshum |
berick: I just filed https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1297967 to go poke at our docs for openils-mapper, but it occurs to me that mbklein is presently here at code4lib and maybe we should ask him what he thinks about merging your work. |
| 13:20 |
pinesol_green |
Launchpad bug 1297967 in Evergreen "document openils-mapper code for enriched EDI" (affected: 1, heat: 6) [Undecided,New] |
| 13:21 |
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afterl joined #evergreen |
| 13:22 |
berick |
bshum: thanks, and good idea |
| 13:28 |
kmlussier |
Has anyone put the Awesome box idea on LP yet? |
| 13:28 |
kmlussier |
If not, I will. :) |
| 13:28 |
jihpringle |
kmlussier ++ |
| 13:31 |
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StephenGWills joined #evergreen |
| 13:32 |
* rfrasur |
found an actual box that shall be the library's Awesome Box (it was in there all along...duh). |
| 13:32 |
jeff |
i didn't consider my ideas well-enough-fleshed for a wishlist bug yet. |
| 13:33 |
rfrasur |
kmlussier++ #thank you |
| 13:34 |
jeff |
i wasn't sure if it was an actual thing or just another library idea that ends up being a pain with little added value. ;-) |
| 13:34 |
rfrasur |
jeff++ |
| 13:34 |
rfrasur |
very nice |
| 13:35 |
rfrasur |
and :p |
| 13:42 |
jeff |
Please don't think I'm making fun -- I liked the quote and I've thought similar before. :-) |
| 13:43 |
rfrasur |
lol, even if you were making fun, I wouldn't take offense. |
| 13:43 |
rfrasur |
But I didn't think that. |
| 13:43 |
jeff |
That said, we try to give things an early try and not worry too much about if they're going to fail (especially when it's not something that requires major up-front investment of time or money before determining if it'll pay off). |
| 13:44 |
rfrasur |
same here. as much as it's within my power and ability, at least. |
| 13:44 |
rfrasur |
Especially free things that are fun and patrons could actually enjoy. |
| 13:49 |
jeff |
I wonder what Bowker BMS pricing is like. |
| 13:52 |
jeff |
Strong sense of deja vu, also. :P |
| 13:53 |
rfrasur |
I dunno anything about Bowker accept something very vaguely from days gone by. |
| 13:53 |
rfrasur |
back when I had access to things I can't afford anymore |
| 13:58 |
rfrasur |
(which sounds like I'm bitter, but I'm not - poor agrees with me) |
| 14:02 |
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| 14:04 |
gerson |
#quit |
| 14:05 |
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| 14:05 |
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| 14:40 |
rangi |
bradl/ eeevil : laptop ordered .. it should arrive well before I do, thanks heaps once again |
| 14:43 |
eeevil |
rangi: np. glad to help |
| 15:10 |
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| 15:16 |
bshum |
Whoa, the google cse box on the docs site is GREAT. |
| 15:17 |
bshum |
That's new I think |
| 15:17 |
kmlussier |
Yes, that is new. |
| 15:17 |
kmlussier |
I don't think it was there yesterday. |
| 15:18 |
* kmlussier |
wants to know who did it so that she can give them karma. |
| 15:23 |
* alynn26 |
would like to send karma also. That was not there yesterday! |
| 15:25 |
phasefx |
they should divide the EG versions into tags/facets (not complaining) |
| 15:25 |
kmlussier |
Ooh! I like that idea. |
| 15:25 |
phasefx |
we used to do such with the CSE for the main site |
| 15:26 |
* kmlussier |
misses CSE on the main site. |
| 15:26 |
jeff |
i don't know if we yet have structure enough to support it, but i do like how PostgreSQL docs mostly/usually have a series of links to "this page in the X.Y version of the docs" |
| 15:27 |
jeff |
it quite handily gets around the "google sent me to the PostgreSQL 8.2 version of this page when I'm running 9.3" |
| 15:28 |
phasefx |
should add the ability to add comments too |
| 15:29 |
phasefx |
(again, not complaining, and not volunteering ;) |
| 15:31 |
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| 15:34 |
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| 15:38 |
csharp |
postgresql_as_a_model_for_good_docs++ |
| 15:39 |
* rfrasur |
ponders buying a red velvet cheesecake to share with friends. |
| 15:40 |
* phasefx |
is a friend and is in favor of that :) |
| 15:41 |
rfrasur_cheeseca |
If you were closer, I would LOVE to share it with you. |
| 15:41 |
* rfrasur_cheeseca |
adds cheesecake to #egils15 agenda |
| 15:41 |
rfrasur_cheeseca |
brb |
| 15:41 |
jcamins |
rfrasur_cheeseca: oooh. Maybe I should master cheesecake baking. |
| 15:43 |
* kmlussier |
considered baking cookies for #egils14, but ended up being too busy doing conferency things. |
| 15:46 |
* csharp |
bakes and would be happy to do so for a meeting where he has access to a kitchen |
| 15:46 |
jcamins |
kmlussier: you should have #egils15 in New York. I can guarantee there would be cookies. :) |
| 15:47 |
jcamins |
Ask bshum. Half my suitcase was taken up by cookies on my way out to KohaCon. |
| 15:47 |
kmlussier |
New York? Then I guess Pioneer would need to host it. |
| 15:48 |
jeff |
phasefx: i am less enamored with comments in docs, but i'm not opposed. :-) |
| 15:48 |
kmlussier |
jcamins: How do you package them so that they don't get smooshed? |
| 15:49 |
jcamins |
Actually, have bshum host it. I could get to CT. :) |
| 15:49 |
* kmlussier |
ponders the logistics of packing cookies for her upcoming trip to Atlanta. |
| 15:49 |
jcamins |
kmlussier: a lot of them got smooshed. :( |
| 15:49 |
csharp |
kmlussier: what are you doing in ATL? |
| 15:49 |
phasefx |
jeff: to follow postgres model, we could choose to view the docs with or without the comments |
| 15:49 |
jcamins |
The ones that didn't I put in cleaned Chinese takeout containers. |
| 15:49 |
bshum |
jcamins: No, we'll just have chinese food at my house. |
| 15:49 |
bshum |
Obviously. |
| 15:49 |
kmlussier |
jcamins: MA was too far? |
| 15:50 |
bshum |
jcamins++ # cookies :) |
| 15:50 |
jcamins |
kmlussier: yeah, it was too far for a day trip, and I couldn't make the middle of the week. |
| 15:50 |
* phasefx |
was talking with a librarian at the conference about how cool it would be if folks would base their local docs off the main docs, and have it where we could switch between them with a drop-down menu |
| 15:50 |
kmlussier |
csharp: I'm going to a Lyrasis thing next month, but am planning a stop to the Equinox offices. |
| 15:50 |
jeff |
phasefx: local overlay to community docs? |
| 15:50 |
phasefx |
the convention might be that you put local stuff in a branded "info" box to distinguish it from stock Evergreen |
| 15:50 |
phasefx |
right |
| 15:50 |
jeff |
phasefx: "this is how we use this here", etc. |
| 15:51 |
jeff |
interesting. |
| 15:51 |
phasefx |
exactly |
| 15:51 |
csharp |
kmlussier: ah - cool |
| 15:51 |
jeff |
somewhat similar to how some of the in-client help was at least theorized |
| 15:51 |
kmlussier |
jcamins: Ah, that's too bad. We'll just need to do a joint koha/Evergreen conference so that I can finally meet you. |
| 15:51 |
bshum |
I still wish we could have made more use of those html help files. Alas |
| 15:51 |
phasefx |
jeff: so we have incentive for folks to contribute to improving the stock docks, and we share customizations as a way of providing examples/background/context |
| 15:52 |
jcamins |
kmlussier: if I ever visit Boston, I'll announce it in #evergreen. |
| 15:52 |
jeff |
so, syndetics plus support should be quite do-able. there are quirks that i'll bring up with bowker support, but the big hurdle is gone. |
| 15:54 |
* rfrasur |
has returned sans cheesecake (they sold the last one before she arrived) but with chocolate croissants (she's also feeling the need to be particularly nice to staff today) and with cheesecakes ordered for friend-sharing next week. |
| 15:55 |
kmlussier |
Chocolate croissants are so much better than cheesecake. |
| 15:56 |
rfrasur |
I've never had one (if you can believe that). |
| 15:56 |
jcamins |
I should make chocolate croissants. |
| 15:57 |
mceraso |
Weren't there chocolate croissants during breakfast at the conference last week? |
| 15:57 |
csharp |
nom nom nom |
| 15:57 |
rfrasur |
mceraso, I think so...but that's too much in the morning. |
| 15:57 |
kmlussier |
mceraso: I don't know but they had them at the Au Bon Pain across the street. |
| 15:58 |
mceraso |
Oooo! I missed going in there! |
| 15:59 |
Christineb |
How do I get in on cheesecake friend sharing??? |
| 16:00 |
rfrasur |
Christineb: Move to east central Indiana? |
| 16:00 |
rfrasur |
or visit |
| 16:00 |
Christineb |
Does east central Indiana have snow right now??? |
| 16:00 |
* rfrasur |
shares within a 2 county radius |
| 16:00 |
rfrasur |
Nope, it melted this morning. |
| 16:01 |
Christineb |
Hooray!, Ok done. Cheesecake... Indiana here I come |
| 16:02 |
rfrasur |
But not til next Wednesday. Apparently, it takes the baker a good four days from start to finish....so they're scheduled for next Wednesday. |
| 16:02 |
Christineb |
Sounds like a very delicious cheesecake! |
| 16:04 |
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| 16:04 |
rfrasur |
It is ;) |
| 16:05 |
remingtron |
bshum: kmlussier: alynn26: Robert Soulliere added the google search to the docs. Hopefully he'll have time to add it to the whole docs template soon. |
| 16:05 |
remingtron |
send some cheesecake his way |
| 16:05 |
kmlussier |
rsoulliere++ |
| 16:05 |
bshum |
rsoulliere++ |
| 16:06 |
rfrasur |
rsoulliere++ |
| 16:06 |
alynn26 |
rsoulliere++ |
| 16:06 |
kmlussier |
@karma rsoulliere |
| 16:06 |
pinesol_green |
kmlussier: Karma for "rsoulliere" has been increased 51 times and decreased 0 times for a total karma of 51. |
| 16:06 |
kmlussier |
He really deserves more karma than that. rsoulliere++ |
| 16:08 |
rfrasur |
Ugh! I only get 25-30 minutes with classes tomorrow. It's not enough time! (brief pseudo_childrens_librarian_rant) |
| 16:09 |
rfrasur |
Also, I might have snipped at an employee that told me to check the library's answering machine because the announcement has the wrong hours. |
| 16:09 |
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| 16:09 |
rfrasur |
so, I bought them croissants. |
| 16:10 |
* rfrasur |
mutters something about being an enabler. |
| 16:14 |
lchenry |
Hi, y'all - is there a way to force Evergreen to send an email to a patron for testing purposes? |
| 16:14 |
rfrasur |
lchenry: what are you testing? |
| 16:14 |
rfrasur |
the validity of the email address or something else? |
| 16:15 |
lchenry |
We have a patron whose hold notifications are dated 12/31/1969 |
| 16:15 |
lchenry |
I read that this could be a problem with some phones, and I wanted to see if it displayed the same way on a laptop or desktop |
| 16:15 |
lchenry |
and she's already deleted the notifications she had |
| 16:16 |
rfrasur |
Personally, and as a nontechy person, I'd temporarily change her email address to my own, and repeat the scenario that caused the notification. |
| 16:17 |
lchenry |
Right, but that could take a couple of hours. She's in the library right now. |
| 16:17 |
csharp |
lchenry: yes, that's a client-side issue |
| 16:17 |
bshum |
I've seen that sort of date bug before with my work email server + gingerbread android devices (kindle fire, phone, etc.) |
| 16:17 |
bshum |
It wouldn't be something Evergreen would fix. It might be the email provider |
| 16:17 |
lchenry |
True |
| 16:17 |
csharp |
lchenry: lots of links on the google about that issue |
| 16:17 |
bshum |
Or just the bug in android |
| 16:17 |
rfrasur |
I doubt you're going to be able to troubleshoot it effectively with the patron standing right there. |
| 16:18 |
lchenry |
I also found something that is an Evergreen thing: http://statelibrary.ncdcr.libguides.com/thenest/news |
| 16:18 |
csharp |
in any case, it would be an issue with the MTA, not Evergreen per se |
| 16:18 |
lchenry |
the October 8 posting |
| 16:19 |
Dyrcona |
lchenry: That date usually means the email had no date in it and the patron's email client added one. |
| 16:21 |
bshum |
I don't recognize that date variable. Maybe that's something custom in NC Cardinal's A/T? |
| 16:21 |
lchenry |
Could be |
| 16:21 |
bshum |
Or maybe it's something newer that snuck into newer releases and our A/T templates are just super old :D |
| 16:21 |
bshum |
lchenry: Are you part of NC Cardinal? |
| 16:22 |
bshum |
If so, maybe you should pester them to make sure that it's really fixed. |
| 16:22 |
lchenry |
No |
| 16:22 |
lchenry |
Just something I found when Googling |
| 16:22 |
* bshum |
looks for stock |
| 16:23 |
lchenry |
But my original question: Is there a way to force a test email? That would be handy, not just for this but for other email problems. |
| 16:23 |
bshum |
Okay, that date thing must be custom somewhere, I'm not seeing anything like that in the stock A/T definitions at least. |
| 16:24 |
lchenry |
Fair enough. Thanks for looking. |
| 16:24 |
csharp |
lchenry: your sys admin can use mutt or something to send an email from the server, if that's what you want |
| 16:24 |
bshum |
I think in the A/T admin interface there's a test area |
| 16:24 |
bshum |
But I don't know if/how it works |
| 16:24 |
* csharp |
doubts it does that level of testing |
| 16:24 |
bshum |
csharp's suggestion is probably best to determine if there's any wacky config issues on the server in question. |
| 16:26 |
* Dyrcona |
thinks it is more likely to be the template and not the server. |
| 16:26 |
lchenry |
Yeah, I don't have access to the back end of it, and the EG admin is home sick. I was hoping not to bug him. :) |
| 16:26 |
phasefx |
lchenry: if you don't care about the email content, you could use the Email link from a record summary page in the TPAC |
| 16:26 |
phasefx |
if authenticated as the patron |
| 16:26 |
csharp |
phasefx++ # good thought |
| 16:26 |
bshum |
phasefx++ # good idea |
| 16:26 |
bshum |
Jinx! |
| 16:27 |
lchenry |
haha |
| 16:27 |
* csharp |
high fives bshum |
| 16:27 |
lchenry |
Good thought, thanks! |
| 16:27 |
bshum |
lchenry: Do let us know though what client the patron was using. I'd be curious to know if it's similar to issues I've seen in my own email on personal devices. |
| 16:28 |
lchenry |
I certainly will! |
| 16:28 |
bshum |
gingerbread-- |
| 16:28 |
csharp |
in our experience, it ends up being a client-side issue, though, fwiw |
| 16:28 |
csharp |
e.g., it's not happening to everyone, or you'd hear more about it |
| 16:29 |
lchenry |
Right |
| 16:29 |
lchenry |
I actually found a lot of results about messages dated 12/31/1969 with no subject or content, with iOS and Android. Bizarre. Never seen it myself. |
| 16:32 |
jeff |
the underlying reason is typically that the Date: header is missing or otherwise not in a format that the email client can handle. many software programs internally store dates as "number of seconds since midnight January 1 1970, UTC" -- and if you're in the US, you're going to be a few hours behind UTC... |
| 16:33 |
jeff |
...therefore, a "number of seconds since 1/1/1970 UTC" gets interpreted in your timezone as "sometime December 31, 1969" |
| 16:33 |
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tspindler left #evergreen |
| 16:33 |
csharp |
jeff++ # clear explanations |
| 16:33 |
lchenry |
Thanks, jeff |
| 16:34 |
jeff |
(this isn't likely to be helpful in fixing the problem on your end, if there even is a problem on your end, but this might end up helping you out if you ever find yourself in a round of UNIX trivia) |
| 16:34 |
lchenry |
Haha, any knowledge is good knowledge. |
| 16:34 |
csharp |
lchenry++ |
| 16:34 |
bshum |
trivia++ |
| 16:34 |
remingtron |
berick: what's required to get a test instance of your web staff client code running? |
| 16:36 |
bshum |
For myself, I grabbed one of berick's working branches |
| 16:36 |
bshum |
http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=working/Evergreen.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/collab/berick/web-staff-proto |
| 16:36 |
bshum |
And installed that branch of code alongside other things in our test system. |
| 16:37 |
bshum |
There's a few branches floating around though, so berick might know which ones he wants people to poke with more specifically. |
| 16:37 |
bshum |
But I had the most luck with that. |
| 16:37 |
jeff |
a surprising number of things are tolerant of a mis-permissioned metabib.full_rec view. |
| 16:37 |
jeff |
but added content is not one of those things. |
| 16:38 |
jeff |
(owner/permissions on metabib.full_rec in a dev test db was wrong) |
| 16:38 |
remingtron |
bshum: do you think a normal install is necessary, or could I just drop his template and js folders in place? |
| 16:39 |
bshum |
remingtron: So what I actually did in the end was squashed all of berick's changes into a single commit and tacking that onto our custom blends we build. |
| 16:40 |
bshum |
remingtron: From that squash, I can see changes to fm_IDL.xml, eg_vhost, and a perl module |
| 16:40 |
bshum |
So it's not just as simple as just the templates and js |
| 16:40 |
bshum |
Though that is the biggest part of files changed. |
| 16:40 |
remingtron |
bshum++ #thanks for the info |
| 16:40 |
bshum |
So... to be safe, I would still merge his branch into whatever you want to build from |
| 16:41 |
bshum |
But that's up to you if you want to poke at all the commits and make more incremental changes to an existing system. |
| 16:42 |
remingtron |
sounds like a fresh build is best. thanks |
| 16:42 |
berick |
remingtron: what bshum said, but beware the latest code requires websockets opensrf. change t_base_js.tt2 to avoid websockets (the opensrf_xhr.js bits and the comment out OpenSRF.Session.transport should do it).[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C[C |
| 16:43 |
* berick |
curses this connection |
| 16:43 |
bshum |
Ahh, didn't notice that in the newest branch |
| 16:43 |
bshum |
My test build didn't include that fun stuff :) |
| 16:43 |
bshum |
I pulled early |
| 16:43 |
jeff |
kmlussier: the wifi at the evergreen conference this year was quite decent, especially in comparison to what i'm heading from code4lib 2014 :-) |
| 16:44 |
* rfrasur |
concurs |
| 16:44 |
* dbs |
nods vigorously |
| 16:44 |
* csharp |
t rie s to type fffro m code4libbbbbbbbb |
| 16:44 |
rfrasur |
hehe, nice |
| 16:45 |
jeff |
and i am pleased to report that there was no $18/day charge on my bill for in-room wifi, either. :-) |
| 16:45 |
dbs |
so csharp / bshum , have you written any selenium tests yet? |
| 16:46 |
rfrasur |
jeff: that was also quite lovely. |
| 16:46 |
* dbs |
is delighted to only be dealing with crappy wifi here |
| 16:46 |
csharp |
dbs: nossir |
| 16:46 |
dbs |
csharp: what are you waiting for? 15 minutes of intro so far! :) |
| 16:46 |
jeff |
i need to look at selenium again. i think my last selenium tests were for jspac. :-) |
| 16:46 |
csharp |
heh |
| 16:47 |
jeff |
and they were more along the lines of "it takes HOW long to load X from a cold browser cache?" |
| 16:47 |
dbs |
jeff: really good presentation on it right now |
| 16:47 |
jeff |
awesome. |
| 16:47 |
bshum |
dbs: I haven't poked at it, but I remember the lightning talk in vancouver about it |
| 16:48 |
jeff |
<META NAME="Generator" CONTENT="Microsoft Word 97"> |
| 16:48 |
jeff |
<TITLE>NOIMAGE1</TITLE> |
| 16:49 |
phasefx |
we can make it easier for selenium tests too if we embed some non-localizable keywords to indicate state in the HTML we produce |
| 16:50 |
phasefx |
then you can make assertions against the presence or absence of those keywords |
| 16:50 |
dbs |
phasefx: that sounds kind of terrible, actually |
| 16:51 |
phasefx |
I saw that in use when I researched it, but the whole practice of UI testing is kind of terrible IMO :) |
| 16:52 |
phasefx |
why does that specifically sound terrible? |
| 16:53 |
Dyrcona |
"the whole practice of software is kind of terrible" FTFY, phasefx. |
| 16:53 |
Dyrcona |
:) |
| 16:53 |
phasefx |
thanks man |
| 16:53 |
dbs |
Dyrcona++ |
| 16:53 |
* Dyrcona |
is tired and cranky at the moment. |
| 16:53 |
dbs |
phasefx: test the actual things in the UI, like class properties for state |
| 16:54 |
* rfrasur |
is too. |
| 16:54 |
Dyrcona |
rfrasur++ # for putting up with a different brand of crazy. |
| 16:54 |
rfrasur |
I'm not sure how much I put up with it. I feel like I'm nagging at people every five minutes. |
| 16:55 |
* dbs |
takes meds these days and finds he's not as cranky (believe it or not) |
| 16:55 |
phasefx |
dbs: I think I erred using a word like state; too strong. What I read was that you aim for testing the widgets/controls, but don't go for testing functional behavior per se |
| 16:55 |
* rfrasur |
takes a deep breath and goes to get some tea. |
| 16:55 |
* csharp |
never saw much actual sign reading in his frontline public library staff days |
| 16:56 |
rfrasur |
csharp: not even when the librarian is actually putting her hand under the words and reading it aloud? |
| 16:56 |
rfrasur |
and explaining the motivation behind it? |
| 16:56 |
csharp |
rfrasur: correct - even then |
| 16:56 |
* rfrasur |
needs more than tea. |
| 16:57 |
* Dyrcona |
is signing out for the day. |
| 16:57 |
Dyrcona |
Have fun! |
| 16:58 |
kmlussier |
jeff: Yes, I was generally pleased with the wifi, especially since we ultimately had to cut back on the bandwidth we could offer. |
| 16:59 |
kmlussier |
jeff: And did you ultimately get your "oceans" of bandwidth in the guest rooms? :) |
| 17:04 |
* rfrasur |
could stream Korean drama in the rooms. It was a fair river at least. |
| 17:07 |
rfrasur |
(because the internet is all about drama...and if it's Korean...it sounds smart) |
| 17:11 |
phasefx |
물론 |
| 17:12 |
rfrasur |
phasefx++ |
| 17:13 |
rfrasur |
character blocks are interesting in small spaces. |
| 17:14 |
phasefx |
we could have some very dense UI's if we all read Korean or Chinese :) |
| 17:14 |
rfrasur |
Yes, let's not (yet) |
| 17:14 |
phasefx |
;) |
| 17:16 |
rfrasur |
I'd actually like to visit the Eunpyeong Public Library. They have a filial piety collection, and I figure if I'm nice then I can talk to someone about translating EG into Korean. |
| 17:16 |
phasefx |
that would rock |
| 17:17 |
rfrasur |
yep :D and then the Japanese would just naturally start working on it...because who wants to be shown up? |
| 17:18 |
rfrasur |
and then the Chinese could...since the Japanese would have already started with the hanja characters...and some Koreans as well...and eastern world domination. |
| 17:18 |
* rfrasur |
has already planned it. |
| 17:19 |
phasefx |
I think the Chinese have already beat the others to EG translations |
| 17:20 |
rfrasur |
Really? |
| 17:20 |
rfrasur |
hmm, that's okay. plans are fluid. |
| 17:22 |
phasefx |
maybe not a well maintained translation? I don't know the state of things these days |
| 17:23 |
rfrasur |
I'd be interested to find that out...for several reasons, but mostly because it's interesting. |
| 17:23 |
phasefx |
and it looks pretty |
| 17:23 |
phasefx |
armenian looks pretty too |
| 17:24 |
jeff |
kmlussier: no, I don't believe the bandwidth I experienced qualified as "oceans of bandwidth" :-) |
| 17:25 |
rfrasur |
Hmm, I've not seen it. (but I will soon...like imminently) Has Evergreen been translated to Hebrew, btw? |
| 17:25 |
kmlussier |
jeff: Then I doubly happy that it didn't appear on your hotel bill. |
| 17:25 |
kmlussier |
Have a nice night everyone! |
| 17:26 |
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| 17:26 |
rfrasur |
Hmm, Armenian has Greek flavors to it. Okay, I need to go get ready for another program. Be well, all y'all. There will be cheesecake in the future. |
| 17:29 |
gmcharlt |
mmm. cheesecake </homer_simpson_voice> |
| 17:31 |
* jeff |
cocks his head and wonders why syndetics plus breaks out images for journals as a distinct from any other image element. |
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| 19:19 |
bshum |
Bmagic++ # showing us his card tricks at dinner! |
| 20:36 |
jeff |
' |
| 20:36 |
jeff |
er. |
| 20:36 |
jeff |
hi. |
| 20:52 |
jeffdavis |
' |
| 20:52 |
jeffdavis |
(gotta close them quotes) |
| 20:54 |
jeff |
Glad I'm not the only one who does that, though usually to myself. |
| 20:55 |
jeff |
huh. anyone remember the old old parody of the Good Times virus hoax? It was called "Bad Times", and the warning claimed that it would do crazily implausible things like "recalibrate your freezer's coolness setting so all your ice cream melts"? |
| 20:56 |
jeff |
Apparently that parody of the hoax was created by Patrick Rothfuss (author of the Kingkiller Chronicle: The Name of the Wind, The Wise Man's Fear, etc.) |
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