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IRC log for #evergreen, 2013-07-30

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09:21 mmorgan jboyer-isl: your suggestion to delete rows from the action_trigger.event table worked, I was able to rerun my test trigger. Thanks!
09:22 jboyer-isl Good to hear. maybe now I can clean up some of the failed events that are sitting around in ours. :D
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09:33 bshum So I'm getting some javascript errors on large pull lists when using the "Clear Hold Shelf" option directly off the Circulation menu actions.
09:34 bshum If I go browse the hold shelf directly, let it load, then click "view clearable holds" it eventually loads them all, then clicking "Clear these holds" takes some time (with a long script running prompt)
09:34 bshum But eventually clears
09:34 bshum I'm wondering if the direct action is doing something weird and dying out.
09:34 bshum Possibly an unfinished issue with bug 1017989
09:34 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1017989 in Evergreen 2.4 "fix clear shelf action with 25 or more holds" (affected: 6, heat: 28) [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1017989
09:35 * bshum tries capturing the JS error message
09:37 bshum Oh, you know what it might be... something interrupted the action script and it generated as an incomplete JS error.
09:37 * bshum will investigate further.  Sorry for the potential false alarm.
09:38 bshum Ah there it is.
09:38 bshum So there's two kinds of errors
09:39 bshum http://pastie.org/8190066
09:39 Dyrcona bshum: bad and worse?
09:39 bshum The first happens if it takes too long and dies I'm thinking
09:39 bshum The second seems to happen if you get frustrated and kill it off or close the window in any way.  Since it interrupts it
09:42 bshum Okay I've consistenly made the first error network timeout happen three times now with different sized hold shelfs over 25+ (a few hundred really)
09:45 Dyrcona bshum: SNAFU....
09:46 bshum Dyrcona: Apparently.
09:46 bshum I'll ponder this more when I get to the office.
09:47 bshum I'm wondering if this is more consequence of slow hold retargeting (as it clears the holds and finds new targets) biting us in other places.
09:47 csharp bshum: maybe related to bug 1167979?
09:47 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1167979 in Evergreen "Circulation > Clear Shelf-Expired Holds fails " (affected: 3, heat: 16) [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1167979
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09:47 * csharp was just looking at unresolved PINES dev requests and came across that one
09:48 bshum csharp: Yeah that sounds like it.  I really need to re-read the bugs again.
09:48 RoganH Does PINES have a long list of dev requests?
09:48 * bshum marks it confirmed :D
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10:01 csharp RoganH: always ;-)
10:01 csharp bshum++
10:02 RoganH csharp: I'm always curious, lol.  In SCLENDS we always have a long list of casual development interests but a much shorter serious list.  I've assumed it's that way everywhere but never know.
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10:20 Dyrcona It's not free as in beer, nor is it free as in freedom. It's free as in kittens.
10:24 phasefx in that sense, nothing is free :)
10:24 Dyrcona Exactly.
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11:14 jeff_ Dyrcona: i'm starting to push things up to https://github.com/tadl/iNCIPit in preparation for our enabling of ncip tomorrow afternoon. You had asked about it the other day.
11:15 Dyrcona jeff_: Cool. Thanks for letting me know. I'm interested in what changes you've made to it.
11:16 jeff_ i've incorporated all of the changes you and dan made in the jonscott repo
11:16 jeff_ (so that i'm not starting from an already-diverged point)
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13:07 bshum I think freenode hates me
13:08 Dyrcona And a number of others, apparently. ;)
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13:28 Dyrcona bshum, wb!
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14:13 dbwells jeff_: Let me know whenever you are done with your latest NCIP commits, and I will pull those into the jonscott repo right away.
14:13 jeff_ dbwells: thanks!
14:14 jeff_ dbwells: are you guys using the duplicate message detection? i've removed it in https://github.com/tadl/iNCIPit/commit/5​37b6a763ae6ec1a48d1bd9439daa177436f3bf1
14:15 dbwells jeff_: If your testing shows it should be removed, I have no issue with removing it.
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14:22 Dyrcona FWIW, I thought it should be removed the first time that I tried testing iNCIPit.
14:24 jeff_ In testing, we rarely received duplicate messages (other than those that were legit retries after a failure to respond properly). The duplicate message detection was apparently due to an old issue that is no longer an issue, and it can cause problems such as failure to auth the same patron twice in a row.
14:24 jeff_ Also, it would require shared storage or a modification to use memcache to work in multi-server environments, so I was pleased when told by MeLCat staff that it should no longer be needed. :-)
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14:29 bshum Am I back?  Maybe...
14:30 rfrasur You're here.  Is this where you meant to be?
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14:32 bshum Perhaps.
14:32 Dyrcona Yes, but for how long?
14:32 bshum I've just been having weird disconnect problems today :(
14:32 bshum Dyrcona: That is the question....
14:32 kmlussier bshum: Nice to see you again!
14:33 Dyrcona And here I thought Dyrcona was the answer. :p
14:33 rfrasur Dyrcona++
14:35 RoganH bshum: you've been popping in and out more than a rabbit on methamphetamines
14:36 rfrasur hmm, I'm not sure if that's good or not.
14:36 rfrasur sounds like an ifunny video
14:36 RoganH given that his connection has been wonky I'd say bad, I just hope it's just IRC
14:37 RoganH It's probably just the NSA trying to make sure they get a full stream of his activity though.  Apparently his emails, calendars and phone calls aren't enough anymore.
14:37 Dyrcona OFTC has not been causing him problems.
14:38 bshum Yeah, it's something weird with freenode from my linode.  It just couldn't maintain a connection, pinging out, etc.
14:39 bshum I'm crossing my fingers that it's calmed down a bit.
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14:40 RoganH Nah, I prefer the paranoid over the rational and data driven answer.  Clearly the NSA.  I have my tinfoil hat on.
14:40 Dyrcona Once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, three times is enemy action...
14:42 * rfrasur likes to leave catchphrases for the NSA
14:42 rfrasur but I won't do it in here.
14:42 RoganH See Ben?  I'd check for bugs.  And a tail.
14:42 rfrasur (and also North Korea)
14:43 RoganH North Korea can't heat their own apartments.  They're not high on my worry list.
14:43 rfrasur Oh, I'm not worried about any of them.
14:44 rfrasur which is why it's fun...ish
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14:45 RoganH I worry about the threats that no one expects.
14:45 rfrasur Expect them ;-)
14:45 rfrasur If someone can dream it up, someone else can and will eventually implement it
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14:47 rfrasur and that's not even counting natural catastrophe.
14:47 * rfrasur is a ray of sunshine on a cloudy day.
14:47 rfrasur :D
14:49 rfrasur (this is what happens when I get everything planned done on my day off)
14:49 * rfrasur goes to find something to do.
14:51 jventuro Good afternoon Evergreen type people!  The Reports Interest Group meeting will begin in about 10 minutes.
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14:59 jventuro The RIG meeting will be starting in 1 minute.  Here's the agenda: http://open-ils.org/dokuwiki/doku.php?i​d=evergreen-reports:meetings:2013-07-30
15:00 jventuro #startmeeting 2013-07-30 Evergreen Reports Interest Group
15:00 pinesol_green Meeting started Tue Jul 30 15:00:09 2013 US/Eastern.  The chair is jventuro. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
15:00 pinesol_green Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
15:00 pinesol_green The meeting name has been set to '2013_07_30_evergreen_reports_interest_group'
15:00 jventuro Hi there!  We'll start with introductions as usual.
15:00 * jventuro is Jessica Venturo, Bibliomation
15:01 * chtrotter is Cristina Trotter, Oconee Regional Library System (PINES)
15:01 jventuro Please introduce yourself if you're participating (don't be shy!)
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15:02 JennB Hello reports!
15:02 * gsams is Geoff Sams, North Texas Library Consortium
15:02 jventuro Hello JennB!
15:03 gsams I'll just be listening in as it were
15:03 gsams I'm trying to become more involved
15:03 jventuro No problem gsams.  Welcome :)
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15:04 chtrotter Hi, JennB and gsams!
15:04 jventuro Is this our whole crew today?
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15:05 chtrotter Lots of folks have been joining the chat. Anyone else here for the Reports Meeting? We are doing intros now.
15:06 dagreen * dagreen is David Green, NC Cardinal (State Library of North Carolina) here to listen in and become more involved, just like gsams
15:06 JennB Im here for reports. Whee!
15:06 jventuro Welcome dagreen
15:06 annag I'm here for the RIG meeting too
15:07 chtrotter Hi annag and dagreen!
15:08 jventuro Welcome, all.  I'll give everyone a minute to look over the notes from the conference: http://open-ils.org/dokuwiki/doku.php?i​d=evergreen-reports:meetings:2013-04-10
15:08 jventuro Let me know if you have any corrections, additions, questions, etc.
15:09 chtrotter Real quick: I don't know if some of y'all are just new to RIG, or IRC chat altogether, but I know when I first joined RIG I was clueless about IRC chatting. I found this site helpful: http://www.ircbeginner.com/​ircinfo/ircc-commands.html
15:10 chtrotter The notes look good to me...based on what I could hear via Skype.
15:11 dagreen Much appreciated on the IRC info, chtrotter. Thank you.
15:11 jventuro That's a great resource.  chtrotter++
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15:13 jventuro if nobody has any further comments about the notes, I'll get started with the first item in old business, sort of an extension of the conversation we had at the conference.
15:13 * csharp is Chris Sharp, GPLS - late, but mostly present
15:14 jventuro Hi csharp!
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15:15 jventuro OK, first #topic Reworking the Wish List
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15:16 jventuro For the newbies and those who need a reminder, the current wish list can be found here: http://open-ils.org/dokuwiki/doku.php​?id=evergreen-reports:rig_wish_lists
15:16 jventuro It hasn't been updated since 2011, and needs some attention.
15:17 jventuro I have an idea about how this might work that I'd like to run past the group, and if anyone else has any ideas as we discuss, feel free to share those also.
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15:18 jventuro I thought it might be a good idea to start fresh and ask for ideas for wish list items on the evergreen-reports email list
15:19 jventuro I would really like for us to track who and where the ideas came from on the wiki so we can follow up
15:19 * csharp can help create requested templates
15:20 jventuro csharp++  I was just going to ask if anyone would like to volunteer to help build templates!
15:21 csharp happy to
15:22 chtrotter I like the idea of tracking them on the wiki, too.  I think some of the items that require development or fixes can added to launchpad (such as the desire to share templates), but help on templates in general would be better off on the wiki, I think.
15:24 chtrotter Does anyone know Brian Feifarek? I see that he noted a couple of wishlist items as "in progress." Maybe we could get an update?
15:24 csharp I believe he was working with LBA under the IMLS grant
15:24 csharp so I don't know if he's around much anymore
15:26 jventuro Do you think it might be a good idea to list names and contact info of whoever is building the template too to avoid such things in the future?  Similar to what DIG does?
15:26 csharp yeah
15:26 csharp it would also be good to know contact info for the requestors as well
15:27 csharp the ones listed there are actually too vague to act on
15:27 chtrotter Agreed.
15:27 jventuro Agreed.  That's why I was thinking we could just start fresh.
15:27 csharp or at least, they are wide open to (mis)interpretation ;-)
15:28 csharp so whoever's requesting needs to be specific about what they want to see and how they need it filtered
15:29 jventuro Yes.  I will mention that in the message I send out on the list.
15:30 jventuro And if we have their contact info, we can get clarification if needed.
15:32 chtrotter Sounds good to me!
15:32 jventuro Any other ideas on how we can make this work?
15:34 chtrotter Well, I would be sure to add request date info and a column for a link to the template instructions. We might need to categorize the wishlist items, since some are template-specific, while others are development ideas.
15:35 jventuro Good idea.
15:36 csharp probably also a good idea for requestors to include their EG version, since that may be a factor in template portability
15:36 jventuro Good call!
15:37 jventuro Do you guys think this should be a survey instead of an email request?
15:38 jventuro I like the idea of a survey because it separates out the questions, but I'm afraid it might make some folks hesitant to respond.
15:39 dagreen Maybe we could ask requesters to send a dummy Excel output? Some of our users are better at describing their needs in that fashion.
15:41 chtrotter I think it is definitely worth suggesting to requesters, if they find it easier to explain their needs.  The survey sounds like an extra step. I was going to ask how we were going to handle email requests. I was thinking that some email requests get such a quick response it is not worth adding to the wishlist, but if there is no answer after a week or so, we could add it to the wishlist. What do y'all think?
15:42 jventuro I think that's a good idea.
15:45 chtrotter Alrightee. So here comes the next question: Who wants to be the lucky person to keep track of the email list for possible wishlist additions?
15:45 jventuro I was wondering the same thing about email requests.  Should I have requesters respond to the list, or directly to me.
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15:46 jventuro I have no problem with doing that, chtrotter.  I am the list admin :)
15:46 AaronZ-PLS Looking for an action trigger hook to send a test email every day, is there one that would work?
15:47 jventuro Hi AaronZ-PLS.  We're having a meeting at the moment.  Would you mind tabling your question for 15 minutes or so?
15:48 AaronZ-PLS Willdo.
15:49 jventuro Thanks!
15:49 chtrotter I would continue to encourage them to be sent to the list first, since there might be a quick response from the community.
15:51 * chtrotter has to run for just a minute. Patron needs help. BRB.
15:52 jventuro OK.  In that case #action Jessica will ask Evergreen-reports list subscribers to send Wish List items and template help requests directly to the reports email list.
15:53 jventuro So I guess anyone who'd like to help with building the templates can just monitor the reports list?
15:53 csharp yep
15:54 jventuro Awesome.
15:54 JennB Sounds good. The list works for me!
15:55 jventuro And anything that doesn't get snagged in a period of time can go up on the wiki.
15:55 jventuro What do we want to set for the time limit?
15:56 JennB for submitting a report?
15:57 chtrotter I would say a week or two.
15:58 jventuro I was thinking the time limit would be how long they go unanswered before they get put on the wiki page, but that's a good point.  Should there be a limit to how long folks can submit ideas?
15:58 csharp well, I think the onus should probably be on the submitter for following up - "no one answered me on the email list, so I'll put this on the wiki"
16:00 kbutler I think they'd be more likely to go up if someone(s) in particular were responsible for putting them on the wiki.
16:01 jventuro I agree with kbutler
16:01 * csharp has got to run but will read the scrollback/log
16:02 jventuro I would certainly encourage folks to post on the wiki, but some things might get lost
16:02 chtrotter I agree. I think there are many folks who are reluctant to edit the wiki.
16:03 chtrotter What do you think about sending a blurb out to both lists every once in a while about the new items on the wishlist? Hopefully this will lure in more folks to work on wishlist items.
16:03 jventuro I think that's a great idea.
16:03 jventuro How often should that happen?
16:04 chtrotter Maybe monthly? Or at least with every reminder about the next RIG meeting.
16:05 jventuro I think monthly is a bit too often.  I was thinking quarterly or twice a year.
16:07 kbutler With the meeting reminders might be good.  But it might depend on the volume of items. If there are hardly any then it would not make sense to do it frequently.
16:07 jventuro I can try certainly try sending it out with meeting reminders to see how it goes.
16:08 jventuro I have a feeling we will see diminishing returns after a while.
16:09 chtrotter Have we determined how long they should be on the list before adding to the wiki?
16:09 jventuro 2 weeks?
16:09 chtrotter Sounds good to me.
16:10 jventuro Very good.
16:11 kbutler Sounds good.
16:11 jventuro #action Jessica will monitor requests and add items that have not been answered within 2 weeks to the wiki.
16:12 jventuro We're way over time.  Any more to say on this topic?
16:12 chtrotter No more from me. I gotta run soon.
16:13 jventuro OK, anything else to bring up before we adjourn?
16:13 jventuro I think the rest of the agenda can be tabled until the next meeting.
16:14 chtrotter Sounds good to me. No real news on the PINES development. We are working out  the requirements.
16:15 jventuro OK, then.  Thanks for coming everybody!
16:15 chtrotter jventuro++
16:15 chtrotter Bye, y'all!
16:16 jventuro #endmeeting
16:16 pinesol_green Meeting ended Tue Jul 30 16:16:17 2013 US/Eastern.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
16:16 pinesol_green Minutes:        http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2013/evergreen.2013-07-30-15.00.html
16:16 pinesol_green Minutes (text): http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2013/evergreen.2013-07-30-15.00.txt
16:16 pinesol_green Log:            http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergree​n/2013/evergreen.2013-07-30-15.00.log.html
16:17 AaronZ-PLS Looking for an action trigger hook to send a test email every day, is there one that would work?
16:21 paxed AaronZ-PLS: if you just want to send a test email, you could just invoke mail directly from crontab ...?
16:21 AaronZ-PLS paxed: Could do that, but looking to make action triggers arent hanging as well as making sure email is happy from end to end
16:36 gsams AaronZ-PLS: I know it wouldn't be quite as informative, but the mail log should be a pretty good indication of whether action triggers are working or not.  I can't say that I've tried looking into it in any other way myself.
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17:49 AndroUser2 This work?
17:51 rfrasur Better?
17:51 rfrasur Hah
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