IRC log for #evergreen, 2025-09-19

All times shown according to the server's local time.

Time	Nick	Message
01:21		jonadab joined #evergreen
07:40		degraafk joined #evergreen
08:41		mmorgan joined #evergreen
08:41		mantis joined #evergreen
08:56		Dyrcona joined #evergreen
09:12	Bmagic	is it possible that 3.12 can't npm ci anymore?
09:15	Dyrcona	IDK. I haven't tried npm ci on anything older than 3.15 for a while.
09:15	Dyrcona	You could do npm install and see what happens. It will update packages.
09:25	Bmagic	I'm getting javascript heap out of memory, even though I'm passing the memory flag
09:26	Bmagic	I think it's a package version issue, knowing that there was poisen in the upstream recently, maybe I need to update package.json to a newer version from 3.13 or 3.14 to get the correct node_modules
10:06	Dyrcona	Not sure. I'm not a huge fan of npm.
10:07	Bmagic	:)
10:07	Dyrcona	Anyway, here's a gist for the Perl program to generate a query to check the actor.usr_purge_data function: https://gist.github.com/Dyrcona/846170f956dc19ccf865bc6e30a09f94
10:07	Bmagic	I'm starting to think my issue actually is memory
10:07	Bmagic	ooo lala
10:07	Dyrcona	I added the POD today, and I'll likely link it from the LP bug I'm working on.
10:08	Bmagic	I do like it
10:08	Dyrcona	Bmagic: I have had a case where I've had to pass some memory option to npm or something in the past to get npm install to work. It has been close to a decade, so my memory is a bit fuzzy.
10:16	Dyrcona	I still can''t find anything that suggest that what I see happening with actor.usr_purge_data is /supposed/ to happen with PostgreSQL. Everything says that a function is run in a transaction, but I can't find much about what happens with you call on function from another. I'll probably have to dig into the PostgreSQL source code.
10:21		mmorgan1 joined #evergreen
10:47	Dyrcona	I should stop looking over code after I've shared it. I see mistakes that aren't actually mistakes...
11:00	Dyrcona	I need to do more investigation. The documentation says that function calls are atomic, but I see evidence that says that may not be true.
11:00	Bmagic	:_) I know the feeling
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11:15	goood	Bmagic: I suspect your npm issue is MAX_MEM_SIZE in /usr/local/lib/node_modules/npm/node_modules/make-fetch-happen/cache.js needs to be increased. it defaults to 5MB, WORKSFORME with 25MB
11:16	Bmagic	goood++
11:16	goood	now, back to ...
11:16	Bmagic	haha
11:16	Bmagic	eeevil++ # even steven
11:17	Bmagic	goood looks weird on you
11:18	eeevil	like Edgar in MIB ;)
11:26	Bmagic	lol, nice pull!
11:29	Bmagic	I gotta say, I think I'm going to miss IRC. Slack has some benefits but it also lacks some of the IRC features
11:30	Bmagic	a selfish reason: we use Slack at work and for other communities, and it's a single window on my computer. If Evergreen chat were also in Slack, I'd have to keep tabbing between Slack servers in a window, whereas IRC is it's own dedicated window.
11:31	Bmagic	(I know we've not made Slack official) but I think it needs to happen to keep Evergreen fresh
11:32	Dyrcona	Meh....
11:32	* Dyrcona	yells at clouds.
11:33	Bmagic	Maybe I can figure out how to run two Slack windows with Docker wrapped around one keeping Slack's internals siloed
11:34	Dyrcona	So, I found this in a StackExchange comment about writing PostgreSQL functions: "Use LISTEN / NOTIFY for longer-running processes that can happen out-of-transaction."
11:34	Dyrcona	I wonder if we can use listen/notify with actor.usr_delete and actor.usr_purge_data?
11:35	Bmagic	related news: Linux Mint is satisfying my needs well enough, I've not needed to format back to Windows in a long time. I know I'm preaching to the chior here. I might be the last one here to switch.
11:35	Bmagic	I read an article that Linux Desktop has increased to 6%, I'd like to think that was me
11:36	Dyrcona	IDK, I'll wager most in here still use Windows on the dekstop/laptop.
11:36	Dyrcona	Arch has been pretty good to me so far.
11:38	Bmagic	Windows provides a pretty darn good desktop expierence. The windows themselves are crispy and the frames are like 1 pixel wide, allowing for more screen realestate for the application.
11:39	* Dyrcona	dives into a 24MB spreadsheet and the database to see if actor.usr_purge_data really is run atomically or if only part of it can fail.
11:39	Bmagic	I'll admit that I've not had a perfect Linux Desktop expierence, but the annoyances haven't angered me enough (this time around)
11:39	Dyrcona	I'm not going to argue about UX. You use what works for you.
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11:39	Bmagic	yeah, that's a good policy
11:40	Bmagic	I think where I was going was: Slack on Linux works fine
11:40	Dyrcona	Heh. I've often had an easier time with Linux than with Windows, but I have more experience using Linxu, to be honest.
11:40	Dyrcona	I'm sure it does. I don't like Slack for some vague reasons.
11:40	* Bmagic	waves at mmorgan
11:41	Bmagic	Maybe I had too much coffee, I'm feeling chatty this morning, sorry to dominate IRC
11:41	* mmorgan	waves at Bmagic
11:41	mmorgan	@coffee Bmagic
11:41	Dyrcona	It's not me this time? :)
11:41	* pinesol	brews and pours a cup of Starlight Blend, and sends it sliding down the bar to Bmagic
11:41	mmorgan	Have some more!
11:41	Bmagic	lol
11:42	Bmagic	Dyrcona: no one can dethrone you
11:42	Dyrcona	:)
11:43	mmorgan	Hail Dyrcona, the monologue king!
11:44	berick	huzzah
11:44	Bmagic	We could put it to a vote, but I think we can safely declare Dyrcona is the king
11:44	berick	Bmagic: did i miss an email re: Slack?
11:44	Bmagic	berick: no, I'm using my imagination
11:44	Dyrcona	Is there a community Slack for Evergreen already? I've been in the one for Aspen a few times.
11:44	Bmagic	not sure when you got here, but there's context going back 20 minutes or so
11:49	berick	ah
11:50	Dyrcona	I think I'll dump the definition of actor.usr_delete to make it easier to view it's definition and that of actor.usr_purge_data side by side.
11:52	Bmagic	Dyrcona++ # dumping definitions and just don't care
11:53	Dyrcona	heh. It's easier than finding them in the code or reviewing them in the database.
11:54	Bmagic	what do you Liinux desktop people do for remote desktop? Remoting into* your Linux desktop
11:54	Bmagic	there doesn't seem to be a better solution than VNC but I'm all ears
11:55	Dyrcona	Well, I don't generally since Linux is my laptop. I have used Remina and VNC in the past.
11:55	Dyrcona	ssh an tmux if I just need cli access, but that's usually on a server.
11:56	Dyrcona	I've used ssh with X forwarding. The Spice protocol with virtual machines also works.
11:56	Bmagic	I find that planting a desktop at work, and remoting into that is beneficial. Compared to using whatever weak internet connection I might be on. It just needs to carry a remote desktop conversation
11:56	Dyrcona	Yeah, I'd suggest Remina for that if you don't want VNC.
11:57	Bmagic	Remina will act as a server?
11:57	Bmagic	(I'm using Remina right now but as a client to remote into my Windows computer at work RDP)
11:58	Dyrcona	Sorry, it's two ms: https://remmina.org/
11:58	Dyrcona	Yeah, Remmina is the client. It does RDP, VNC, etc.
11:58	Bmagic	yep, that's what I thought. It's the reverse that I'm interested in
11:59	Bmagic	It seems I'd need to use a service like Rustdesk
11:59	Dyrcona	I misunderstood the question. I thought you were looking for a client.
12:00	Bmagic	MS RDP is actually pretty good and feature rich
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12:03	Dyrcona	There's xrdp for linux. I forget what I used for the server side of things. I haven't done that in a few years.
12:03	Bmagic	On that topic: MS is depricating traditional RDP in favor of the MS Store Remote Desktop app. Which is stripped down. I can't fathom why they would ditch the tried and true terminal services stuff
12:03	Dyrcona	I think I mostly used Remmina to connect to Windows desktops from Linux anyway.
12:03	Bmagic	Right, that works great (Remmina -> RDP)
12:04	Bmagic	afk
12:04	Dyrcona	Oh, it's lunch time, and I haven't done anything with that spreadsheet other than sort the data.
12:04	Dyrcona	:)
12:06	Dyrcona	We have a lot of deleted patrons with unpurged data hanging around from this past Saturday's batch. I haven't counted.
12:14	Dyrcona	I think I'll write a version of the query that gets the table names where the user id appears. That will save me some time.
12:32	* Dyrcona	shouldn't work through lunch, but that's always been a thing for me.
12:36	Dyrcona	So, I think the PostgreSQL documentation lies(?) when it says functions are atomic. What I see in my spreadsheet for recent deletes are a lot of auditor.actor_usr_history and some auditor.actor_usr_address_history entries. Older deletes have some other tables around but they may not have purged at that time.
12:39	Dyrcona	Looks like those deletes are not finishing but the function moves on...
12:41	Dyrcona	Weird.
12:43	Dyrcona	Think I'll update the gist to do what this copy does. Seeing the tables that the stuck data is in is probably more useful than getting the whole user row.
12:46	Dyrcona	So, one example user that was recently purged had 2 rows left in auditor.actor_usr_history. This same user had the same data on a test system, so I ran the same delete that the usr_purge_data function does and the delete went through. I've got 144,925 rows in the output with actor_usr_history in them. That's the majority.
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12:59	Dyrcona	I have a batch of users at the very beginning that were all purged soon after the migration to Evergreen in 2012. They all have a row in reporter.report_folder. I deleted one on my test server and that seemed to work.
13:09	Dyrcona	Totally unrelated, but I swear I had saved some SQL to reset acq.edi_messages entries so that they would "resend," but can I find it today? Of course not.
13:18	Dyrcona	I thought that there was a resend status I could stick on the messages in the database, but I'm not seeing it in the code.
13:20	Dyrcona	Ah ha! It's retry.
13:22	Dyrcona	Think I'll null the error and error_time fields in case they don't get reset during the retry event.
14:07	Dyrcona	So, we're getting a stfp_error for 1 ingram account when sending purchase orders via sftp. The credentials work, i.e. I can login with sftp and look around.
14:08	Dyrcona	Oh ho! I bet it's the "account" field being filled in.
14:15	Dyrcona	If I delete the messages they'll get recreated won't they?
14:15	Dyrcona	That's not the problem.
14:19	Dyrcona	Oh! I see why the actual sftp error isn't getting printed. "$self->_sftp->error" is being interpolated in a string and that doesn't work. I'll wager that is my fault.
14:21	Dyrcona	Well, I lost that bet.
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14:39	Dyrcona	Nothing like hot patching a server on a Friday afternoon.
14:41	Dyrcona	Oh, man... Could it really be that simple?
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14:48	Dyrcona	Looks like they may have the wrong case for the upload directory.
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15:08	Dyrcona	So, I've got another bug to open when I get it written up, probably Monday. I'm still stumped about the other how some updates aren't finishing in actor.usr_purge_data(). From all I have read that is supposed to unpossible.