Evergreen ILS Website

IRC log for #evergreen, 2020-06-04

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All times shown according to the server's local time.

Time Nick Message
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06:00 pinesol News from qatests: Testing Success <http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live>
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08:42 mmorgan joined #evergreen
08:42 Dyrcona Did Indiana just lose Internet?
08:45 RFrasur_ Possible hiccup.
08:45 RFrasur_ Comcast has had rolling outages over the past few days.  It might be more systemic than that.
08:47 Dyrcona comcast--
08:56 remingtron joined #evergreen
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09:00 csharp comcast--
09:00 csharp @hates
09:00 pinesol csharp hates dojo_hold_policies_interface; SIP; when libraries purchase third party products without testing and blame Evergreen for it not working; reports; the fact that the Base Filters is unnecessarily greyed out when applying an Aggregate Filter and vice versa; evil; reports more; reports even moar; details; reports even more; the fact that the Base Filters is unnecessarily greyed out when applying an (2 more messages)
09:00 csharp @more
09:00 pinesol csharp: Aggregate Filter and vice versa even more; having to teach SIP2 client vendors about the SIP2 specification; troubleshooting reports; money reports; marc; reports even more than before; the EDI ruby bits; acquisitions; <quote>fun<unquote>; edi; sip2; sip too; sip two; acq; acq more; acq way more than before; omg I hate acq; omg I love acq; hate hate hate; comcast; action_triggers; javascript; action_triggers (1 more message)
09:00 csharp @more
09:00 pinesol csharp: more; cookies; and Belated Karma
09:00 csharp ah - comcast is on the list :-)
09:03 remingtron csharp: fun list! I love the sip2 variations, and the acq split personality
09:03 * rfrasur chuckles
09:06 * mmorgan assumes the cookies that csharp hates are the browser kind rather than the chocolate chip kind.
09:06 Dyrcona :)
09:06 Dyrcona @hates
09:06 pinesol Dyrcona hates JavaScript; and Launchpad Search
09:07 Dyrcona @loves csharp
09:07 pinesol csharp loves supybot plugins; virtualization; lasagna; logs; clarity; all y'all; upgrades; tpac; git; this venue; google; not being evil; when evergreen problems turn out to be staff error; the Jedi; pgadmin; policy; lynx; autoupdate; coffee; db02; kvm; CWMARS; mobile catalog; vim; snow; pizza; google forms; chicken soup; cilantro; actual fun; supybot; vimdiff; felafel; postgresql; THE RESISTANCE; vacuum (1 more message)
09:07 Dyrcona @more
09:07 pinesol Dyrcona: full; strong opinions; data; Data from TNG; simple fixes to scary-looking problems; all the things; and Reposity
09:07 rfrasur mmorgan, if he DOES hate chocolate chip cookies, I know a few places he could send surpluses.
09:07 Dyrcona :)
09:07 Dyrcona @hates
09:07 pinesol Dyrcona hates JavaScript; and Launchpad Search
09:07 Dyrcona @loves
09:07 pinesol Dyrcona loves git; sed; OpenBSD; gnu/emacs; git-quickpick; and tmux
09:08 Dyrcona I cleaned mine up a year or two ago.
09:11 rfrasur @hates
09:11 pinesol rfrasur hates MARC; mouthy teens; State of Indiana Department of Workforce Development online interface; stupid state bureaucracy; incessant adult responsibility; Internet Explorer; IE; little blue e; void; Microsoft; Adobe; Disney; Disney a lot; oxford university press hardcovers; facets; reports; governmental_busywork; and cottage_cheese
09:11 rfrasur Hmm, those are still valid
09:11 rfrasur @loves
09:11 pinesol rfrasur loves google; pinesol_green; overcast days; Evergreen; Ze Internetz!; chocolate; Fridays; minions; Google Drive; codabar; explaining Evergreen stuff to member libraries; phasers; sonic screwdrivers; quantum physics; meaningful_policy; and round_tuits
09:12 rfrasur Hmm.  I'd say that "love" is probably an exaggeration in some of those cases.
09:12 Dyrcona You can remove things from the lists
09:13 Dyrcona @help love
09:13 pinesol Dyrcona: (love <thing>) -- Declare your love for <thing>
09:13 Dyrcona @help love/hate
09:13 pinesol Dyrcona: Error: There is no command "love/hate".
09:13 rfrasur No, I think I need to live with the consequences of my younger self.
09:13 Dyrcona :)
09:15 Dyrcona I feel like some things should be on both love and hate for me, but I took them off the list. I decided that I had too many things.
09:16 Bmagic lol
09:16 Bmagic @loves
09:16 pinesol Bmagic loves magic; and Resistance
09:16 Bmagic Nice
09:16 Bmagic @hates
09:16 pinesol Bmagic hates marc
09:16 Bmagic yes! Perfect
09:16 rfrasur very concise!
09:17 Dyrcona :)
09:18 Bmagic Just tested - Pinesol's mind is compartmentalized between IRC channels
09:18 rfrasur that makes sense
09:18 Bmagic I was thinking it would be nice to have a private conversation with it, so we could work out what we wanted it to know without spamming channel
09:19 rfrasur responsible ;)
09:19 Dyrcona Bmagic you can have a private conversation with pinesol. I do it from time to time, mostly for admin stuff.
09:19 Bmagic hmmm
09:20 Dyrcona Just /msg it or do whatever in your IRC client to start a private convo.
09:20 Bmagic just did. Pinsol didn't regurgitate my entries
09:20 Dyrcona Well, that's because you're not in the channel then.
09:21 Dyrcona Ask it for help.
09:22 Dyrcona There's a way to query the module list, and then the entries that it stores per module per channel, and you can have it add/remove things for you.
09:22 Bmagic that's nice
09:22 Bmagic I will be sure and use that when I am confused
09:22 Bmagic The source code somewhere?
09:22 Dyrcona Just google supybot.
09:23 Dyrcona I'm pretty sure we're still using supybot.
09:23 Bmagic sweet
09:23 Bmagic confirmed
09:24 Bmagic https://github.com/Supybot/​Supybot/tree/master/plugins
09:30 mmorgan @hate typing with fingers on the wrong keys
09:30 pinesol mmorgan: The operation succeeded.  mmorgan hates typing with fingers on the wrong keys.
09:31 Dyrcona We should probably switch to Limnoria (https://github.com/ProgVal/Limnoria), supybot's apparent successor.
09:33 Dyrcona wholoves git
09:33 Dyrcona @wholoves git
09:33 pinesol Dyrcona, tsbere, bshum, csharp, gmcharlt, yboston, kmlussier and gsams love git
09:33 Dyrcona @seen tsbere
09:33 pinesol Dyrcona: tsbere was last seen in #evergreen 3 years, 2 weeks, 5 days, 18 hours, 12 minutes, and 38 seconds ago: <tsbere> er, not anoning
09:33 Dyrcona @seen kmlussier
09:33 pinesol Dyrcona: kmlussier was last seen in #evergreen 1 year, 5 weeks, 3 days, 15 hours, 19 minutes, and 50 seconds ago: <kmlussier> parts++ parts++ parts++
09:38 JBoyer_ @hate php
09:38 pinesol JBoyer_: The operation succeeded.  JBoyer_ hates php.
09:38 JBoyer_ _?
09:38 JBoyer @hate php
09:38 pinesol JBoyer: The operation succeeded.  JBoyer hates php.
09:39 rhamby_ that's probably worth adding a few dozen times
09:39 JBoyer php -= INT64_MAX
09:40 JBoyer Similar effect.
09:43 sandbergja joined #evergreen
09:44 JBoyer Fun news for interested parties: loading mod_php with *any other apache mod* that uses openssl will give you instant segfaults on touching php. It's real good. Have to munge the module load order, like you do, in 2020.
09:45 JBoyer (On Debian Stretch, other situations will vary)
09:45 Dyrcona JBoyer: Do you have to load mod_php last?
09:46 JBoyer first
09:46 JBoyer left #evergreen
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09:47 Dyrcona Does it interfere with mod_ssl?
09:47 JBoyer I am again stricken by a stupid keyboard shortcut in my irc client, bye bye backscroll. :/
09:48 Dyrcona :(
09:48 JBoyer Dyrcona, primary issue at the moment is mod_openidc. Something about mod_php being linked against the wrong version of openssl. Still works, but has to be loaded before openidc.
09:48 Dyrcona Sounds like a packaging issue.
09:49 JBoyer It is. Though not using php also fixes the issue. ;)
09:50 Dyrcona I imagine not using openidc would also fix it. :)
09:52 JBoyer The packaging issue is something in the linking for the mod_php package, but yeah, one or the other will work. I have preferences but can get by with a mv auth_... zauth... and try not to think about it
09:56 Dyrcona Rube Goldberg would be so proud of us today. :)
09:59 JBoyer Dyrcona++
10:06 jvwoolf joined #evergreen
10:14 sandbergja joined #evergreen
10:20 csharp @whocares git
10:20 pinesol Dyrcona, tsbere, bshum, csharp, gmcharlt, yboston, kmlussier and gsams love git
10:20 pinesol terran hates git
10:22 berick @loves
10:22 pinesol berick loves mosh; whitespace-as-syntax; digging around in Open-ILS/src/support-scripts/test-scripts and finding a 7 year old script that does exactly what I needed.; asciidoc; breakfast bourbon; and deleting things
10:22 berick @hates
10:22 pinesol berick: berick doesn't seem to hate anything.
10:22 berick that's right
10:22 berick must be the breakfast bourbon
10:23 csharp berick++
10:44 Dyrcona I came, I saw, I deleted all your files.
10:44 Dyrcona berick++
10:49 JBoyer berick++
10:54 rjackson_isl_hom berick++
10:54 Dyrcona You know what the problem with modern programming books is? Eight hundred twenty-four pages.
10:57 Dyrcona That, and then they're usually out of date by the time they're published.
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13:14 dluch 45-minute warning--DIG starts at 2:00 ET
13:37 sandbergja joined #evergreen
13:56 dluch DIG Meeting starts in 5 minutes!
13:56 * alynn26 loves DIG
13:57 dluch :-)
14:00 dluch #startmeeting 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting#startmeeting 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting
14:00 pinesol Meeting started Thu Jun  4 14:00:25 2020 US/Eastern.  The chair is dluch. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:00 pinesol Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
14:00 Topic for #evergreen is now  (Meeting topic: 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting#startmeeting 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting)
14:00 pinesol The meeting name has been set to '2020_06_04___documentation_interest_g​roup_meeting_startmeeting_2020_06_04__​_documentation_interest_group_meeting'
14:00 dluch #topic Agenda
14:00 Topic for #evergreen is now Agenda (Meeting topic: 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting#startmeeting 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting)
14:00 dluch #info The agenda can be found here:  https://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?id=​evergreen-docs:dig_meetings:20200604-agenda
14:00 dluch Welcome everyone!  Today's meeting will be a little bit of discussion but hopefully we'll still have lots of time for collaboration and working on documentation.
14:01 dluch #topic Introductions
14:01 Topic for #evergreen is now Introductions (Meeting topic: 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting#startmeeting 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting)
14:01 dluch Please paste "#info <username> is <name>, <affiliation>" to identify who you are and what organization, if any, you represent.
14:01 dluch #info dluch is Debbie Luchenbill, MOBIUS
14:01 alynn26 #info alynn26 is Lynn Floyd, Evergreen Indiana
14:01 jweston #info jweston is Jennifer Weston, Equinox
14:02 jihpringle #info jihpringle is Jennifer Pringle, BC Libraries Cooperative (Sitka)
14:02 remingtron #info remingtron is Remington Steed, Hekman Library (Calvin University)
14:03 Bmagic #info Bmagic is Blake GH, MOBIUS
14:05 dluch Thank you all for coming! If you join in later, feel free to introduce yourself when you arrive.
14:05 dluch #topic Helpful Information: Documentation contributions and collaboration
14:05 Topic for #evergreen is now Helpful Information: Documentation contributions and collaboration (Meeting topic: 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting#startmeeting 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting)
14:05 dluch #info You can find the Documentation Needs List at https://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php​?id=evergreen-docs:documentation_needs
14:05 dluch #info DIG Roles can be found at https://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.p​hp?id=evergreen-docs:digparticipants
14:06 dluch We are going to do some quick business items...
14:06 dluch #topic Business
14:06 Topic for #evergreen is now Business (Meeting topic: 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting#startmeeting 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting)
14:06 dluch #info Check-in
14:06 dluch First off, how is everyone doing?
14:06 Bmagic I'm doing great! Still loving Evergreen. More than ever!
14:07 alynn26 Good, Updated docs for shelving locations locally last night.
14:07 alynn26 Going to use it as an example next week.
14:07 dluch Great!
14:07 jweston Life is good; trouble accepting that it is June already - looking for to EIC next week
14:08 alynn26 Is it June already. Where did the year go.
14:08 dluch Anyoneback to their buildings/offices or open to the public? We're still working at home
14:08 dluch FOR REAL.
14:08 remingtron We're still remote as well
14:08 alynn26 We are back half time only.
14:08 jihpringle good, we upgrade to 3.5 without any major issues a couple weeks ago
14:08 alynn26 jihpringle, cool.
14:08 dluch jihpringle: that's great!
14:09 jweston jihpringle++
14:09 jihpringle we're all still at home but we're mostly remote anyways, but some of Manitoba libraries are open to the public
14:09 Bmagic jihpringle++
14:10 dluch Yeah, it seems that most of the public libraries around here are either open or preparing to and doing curbside
14:10 alynn26 Lots of Curbside here
14:10 jihpringle we have lots doing or preparing for curbside
14:11 dluch My local library has been doing it for a week, I think? It's kind of nice, though a lot of work for the staff.
14:11 dluch Feel free to continue sharing, but let's move on in the agenda...
14:11 dluch #info Quick update on Antora progress
14:12 Bmagic oh, oh, Antora!?!?
14:12 Bmagic pick me, pick me!
14:12 dluch I will fully admit that I'm lost with some of this stuff. I had a long conversation about it with bmagic after the last meeting, but I may have to ask for clarifications on what we're discussing.
14:12 dluch Bmagic, sure, take it away!
14:13 dluch An Antora commit has been introduced, from what I understand, and needs two signoffs from core committers.
14:13 dluch I guess at the devs meeting, they were uncomfortable with putting it in 3.5. From a conversation I had with bmagic it sounds like they didn't know all the work that's been going on with it or that DIG had officially decided to go forward with Antora as the official docs.
14:13 Bmagic Between last meeting and this, I managed to create an automated script to build the docs. And it's generic, so it's in the repo and shared easily for other folks who want to build their own
14:13 dluch Sweet!
14:14 remingtron Bmagic++
14:14 dluch Bmagic++
14:14 jweston Bmagic++
14:14 dluch So we probably need to start keeping devs in the loop about what we're doing. People who are in DIG and also developers' meetings, would any of you be willing to champion this task?
14:14 Bmagic I sorta love it, just for my own usage, if not anything else
14:14 jihpringle Bmagic++
14:14 dluch [Do I have that right?]
14:15 dluch Awesome, Bmagic!
14:15 alynn26 Bmagic+=
14:15 remingtron Bmagic: so can we change the original docs, then run the script, and the antora docs are updated too?
14:15 remingtron AKA, we don't have to make the change in two places?
14:15 Bmagic oh, no, sorry, it doesn't do that magic
14:15 Bmagic That's a whole other can
14:16 Bmagic after about 2 hours playing with different ideas of how to do that automatically, we decided it needed to be manual
14:16 jvwoolf joined #evergreen
14:17 remingtron okay, gotcha
14:18 dluch And per my text dump above?
14:19 Bmagic It might be possible still. One of the stumbling blocks are the heading upgrades. Git doesn't ignore those. So if we lined up the folders between the two structures, we still see that more of the document is different than needs to be
14:19 Bmagic we also combined several documents into one.... so that breaks git....
14:19 Bmagic dluch: yes, I think this project needs to be (somehow) brought to a larger audience
14:20 remingtron Bmagic, yeah, we've done plenty of manual mangling so far
14:21 dluch Sooo...remingtron and Bmagic, do you both go to dev meetings? Would you be willing to rep DIG there and share what we're doing with Antora?
14:22 Bmagic I brought it up at the last dev meeting
14:22 remingtron Sorry, I've been out of the dev meeting loop recently
14:22 Bmagic I think we need a more formal document. Like a roadmap outline or something like that
14:22 dluch Right, but more regular-like, so they get more comfortable with it
14:23 csharp we can make docs a permanent agenda item if that's appropriate
14:23 dluch roadmap doesn't sound like a bad idea
14:23 Bmagic In other words - we need this to get merged. The sooner the better, so that we don't have to double enter any edits
14:24 dluch csharp++
14:25 Bmagic One thing that I've put on my plate is a "slurp" of the old site. gmcharlt_ spoke about a method back when we setup the new docs server
14:26 dluch Okay, so I'll work on a roadmap thing, unless anyone else wants to do it. But Bmagic and remingtron, I will be relying heavily on you since you've done most of the setup work thus far.
14:26 csharp just added an item to the draft agenda we use for dev meetings as part of the release info: https://wiki.evergreen-ils.org​/doku.php?id=dev:meetings:next
14:26 Bmagic sandbergja: Some time ago, you "backported" some docs over to the Antora branch
14:26 remingtron dluch, Thanks for starting it. I'm happy to review/edit
14:27 dluch csharp: awesome, thank you!!
14:27 remingtron Bmagic, I'm working on the new docs server right now
14:27 csharp :-)
14:27 dluch Also, I've heard that probably the issue of moving the server docs.evergreen-ils.org should be separate from the issue of merging Antora to master. That once we get Antora in then we can change the Antora URL to be the official docs one. Is that correct?
14:28 Bmagic remingtron: you mean you are working to transfer the old stuff to the new one?
14:28 remingtron trying to get it building current docs and antora in one script, plus a landing page with links to all
14:28 remingtron not "transfer", just hand picking what's needed so far
14:28 Bmagic you able to make use of that generate_docs.pl script?
14:28 remingtron like the old build script and its dependencies, installing asciidoc
14:28 remingtron I haven't gotten to the Antora stuff yet
14:29 remingtron but it looks fancy :)
14:29 Bmagic ok great - we should talk after the meeting
14:29 dluch At this point, is it okay to move on in the agenda? We can continue talking about details during working time?
14:29 dluch lol
14:29 dluch #info Reminder: Evergreen International Online Conference is next week!
14:29 dluch The Evergreen International Online Conference is taking place June 9-11 from 12-5 in the afternoons, EDT. If you haven't registered already, please do! You can find the info on the conference website: https://evergreen-ils.org/conference/2020-​evergreen-international-online-conference/
14:29 dluch Hope to see you then! Does anyone have any questions?
14:31 Bmagic I was voluntold to preset - so I'm presenting on Antora. Hope you all can make it!
14:31 Bmagic preset/present
14:31 dluch #info July Meeting
14:31 dluch The next meeting is scheduled for July 2. Does that work for everyone or are a lot of U.S. people off for the holiday? July 9 would be the other option.
14:32 jihpringle I vote for July 9th (we're closed on the 1st for Canada Day so it's a short week for us)
14:33 dluch Thanks, jihpringle!
14:33 Bmagic I read "Canada Dry" at first. Need to increase the font size... lol
14:33 jweston +1 to July 9
14:33 dluch Bmagic: lol
14:34 alynn26 July 9th works for me.
14:34 dluch Alrighty, July 9th it is!
14:34 dluch Thanks, everyone!
14:34 dluch #info We will catch up on other action items and business at the next meeting
14:34 dluch #info Anything else pressing?
14:35 dluch Today's meeting is supposed to be for collaboration time, so let's move on to that!
14:35 dluch #topic Collaboration time
14:35 Topic for #evergreen is now Collaboration time (Meeting topic: 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting#startmeeting 2020-06-04 - Documentation Interest Group Meeting)
14:35 dluch What is everyone planning to work on today?  Please let us know here, and feel free to talk and work with each other.  If you'd like extra accountability, I can make an action item to show up in the minutes, but it's not necessary.
14:36 jihpringle I'm going to work on the experimental catalogue (we've only got as far as how to enable it in our docs)
14:37 dluch excellent! jihpringle++
14:39 jihpringle also our docs are now updated for 3.5 so if anyone wants to repurpose sections for the official docs please do - http://docs.libraries.coop/sitka/
14:39 jweston jihpringle++
14:39 dluch Thank you!!
14:39 alynn26 jihpringle, I already have.  Thanks
14:39 dluch jihpringle++ Sitka++
14:40 jihpringle alynn26++
14:40 dluch alynn26++
14:42 jweston I'll work on some of the older 3.4 cataloging needs (will tag with my name) -- caveat being that I have 0 experience with AsciiDoc so my contributions will be provided the old-fashioned way - until I attend session conference sessions next week
14:43 alynn26 jweston++ looking forward to seeing you there.
14:43 dluch jweston: that's totally fine!
14:43 dluch jweston++
14:44 jweston alynn26++ thanks for presenting on this again! (I've mananged to miss all of your earlier sessions)
14:44 Bmagic alynn26++
14:44 dluch Yes!! alynn26++
14:45 jweston jihpringle: I'm also eager to help with 3.5 experimental catalogue doc - just waiting on my own sandbox for that; may I ping you later this month?
14:46 jihpringle jweston: definitely
14:47 jweston jihpringle++ thanks!  we'll connect soon
14:47 jihpringle sounds good :)
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15:00 dluch We are at time.  Thanks for all the great work, everyone!  Feel free to keep going after the meeting!
15:00 dluch The next meeting will be July 9. Same bat time, same bat channel. Business meeting first then collaboration time (if there's time).
15:00 dluch Please continue using the email list and/or Launchpad for questions and other things that come up in between meetings.
15:00 dluch Thanks for coming!
15:00 dluch #endmeeting
15:00 Topic for #evergreen is now Welcome to the #evergreen library system channel! | We are publicly logged: http://irc.evergreen-ils.org/evergreen | Large pastes at http://paste.evergreen-ils.org | Can't speak? Make sure your nickname is registered and that you are identified to freenode services: https://freenode.net/kb/answer/registration
15:00 pinesol Meeting ended Thu Jun  4 15:00:42 2020 US/Eastern.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
15:00 pinesol Minutes:        http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2020/evergreen.2020-06-04-14.00.html
15:00 pinesol Minutes (text): http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2020/evergreen.2020-06-04-14.00.txt
15:00 pinesol Log:            http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergree​n/2020/evergreen.2020-06-04-14.00.log.html
15:01 jweston dluch++ thanks!
15:01 remingtron dluch++
15:05 Bmagic dluch++
15:06 jihpringle dluch++
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15:55 abneiman dluch++ # sorry I missed the meeting
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18:01 pinesol News from qatests: Testing Success <http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live>
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21:51 Topic for #evergreen is now Welcome to the #evergreen library system channel! | We are publicly logged: http://irc.evergreen-ils.org/evergreen | Large pastes at http://paste.evergreen-ils.org | Can't speak? Make sure your nickname is registered and that you are identified to freenode services: https://freenode.net/kb/answer/registration
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