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IRC log for #evergreen, 2020-04-07

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All times shown according to the server's local time.

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09:05 Bmagic Dyrcona++ # I remember working on something less elegant a couple years back. Had to adjust some due dates en mass, keeping days closed in mind. It was a pain if I recall
09:09 rhamby Dyrcona: I was tempted to point out on list you could create a usable function to remove a character from the end of any given tag/subfield.  hopefully someone wouldn't have cause for that in their records that often though :)
09:10 Dyrcona rhamby: I'm replying to your latest email now and agree on the local schema suggestion. I'm giving two examples of how we use them.
09:11 Dyrcona I generally prefer doing Perl stuff outside of the database, but it is a personal preference.
09:11 rhamby I would agree that if it's a really big number and it needs to be done fast outside db is better but otherwise I'm kind of "whatever works for you" in my attitude
09:23 csharp marcedit is a pretty good solution for people without DB access though - glad Linda spoke up with that suggestion
09:23 Dyrcona Yeah, marcedit works.
09:24 Dyrcona And, probably a good option for Glen.
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09:31 rhamby in his case perl related options might be viable, they have a technical team and are self hosted so they _might_ have someone with the skills to tackle it via perl / language of choice
09:31 rhamby marcedit is a blessing for most though :)
09:38 jeff Everyone is overlooking the obvious solution: regexp_replace()!
09:38 * jeff ducks
09:41 * phasefx will write the stored procedure wrapper for MARC::Record one day :)
09:42 phasefx one for each little sub
09:44 jeff DROP LANGUAGE plperlu;
09:44 phasefx be still my heart
09:49 phasefx what I really want is to the ability use vim on a specific column/row value in the database :D
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10:40 Glen Thanks everybody.
10:42 mmorgan Regarding the MARC update question, what's considered the upper limit to the number of records the in client MARC Batch edit can handle?
10:43 * mmorgan doesn't work much with MARC records.
10:50 csharp mmorgan: I don't know that there's a good number to go on with that - I think the size of the records would be a factor because in the end it's the size of the blob being passed to OpenSRF, how long it will take to process, etc.
10:50 rhamby phasefx: I do wonder what it would take do that
10:51 csharp some of that is necessarily local (speed of hardware, resources allocated, etc.)
10:57 phasefx rhamby: probably would have to return text or xml by default for some of the functions for feeding into other functions, rather than breaking things up immediately as row data
10:58 phasefx gratuituous use of STATIC to make things faster
11:21 phasefx rhamby: or were you talking about vim? :D
11:21 Dyrcona rhamby | phasefx: Not sure if VIM could do it, but I'm pretty sure I could make Emacs do it.
11:21 phasefx could probably get emacs to run postgres
11:21 rhamby phasefx: bad phasefx bad!
11:22 Dyrcona Pretty sure there's already a mode to connect to postgresql and run queries.
11:22 * phasefx never learned emacs
11:22 * rhamby thinks the singularity will happen inside emacs and then it'll just be skynet
11:22 * Dyrcona thinks that has already happened, but Emacs is content just manipulating text. :)
11:23 phasefx what if we're all really.. just text
11:23 Dyrcona phasefx: I sometimes wonder..... The universe could very well be a simulation.
11:23 Dyrcona It is composed of pixels, sort of... look up Planck length.
11:23 phasefx by one argument, the odds are in favor of that
11:24 Dyrcona Yeah.
11:24 phasefx it's interesting though.. imagine we are in a simulation, and we find a way to hack to the host layer :)
11:24 rhamby but if it is a simulation it doesn't really change the nature of our actions or their outcome
11:24 phasefx at least until said hacking :)
11:25 Dyrcona :)
11:25 rhamby phasefx: I'm assuming that's impossible in my premise
11:25 Dyrcona DejaVu could be a bit of residual data in RAM after a reboot.
11:25 phasefx a glitch in the matrix
11:25 rhamby I can think of a lot of things I could attribute to memory not being allocated correctly
11:25 phasefx of course, we can also crash the program
11:26 phasefx one high energy physics experiment gone wrong
11:26 Dyrcona :)
11:26 rhamby we're all just one big game of life, the programmers got bored with resource allocation and proximity so they've thrown new variables in :)
11:28 csharp @decide https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_demon or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simulated_reality
11:28 pinesol csharp: go with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simulated_reality
11:29 phasefx one of the novels I remember reading, had someone from the modern world go to a fantasy world.  For a demon, he decied to summon Maxwell's Demon
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11:33 Dyrcona Yeah, but I'd naively argue that Maxwell's Demon doesn't violate the 2nd law of thermodynamics, because the Demon's interference means it's not a closed system.
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11:34 phasefx IIRC, the guy was essentially hacking the system (magic) by being very clever, because if you did have a Maxwell's Demon, you could do all sorts of crazy stuff with it
11:35 Dyrcona Sure... I imagine having any demon would let you do all kinds of crazy stuff. :)
11:36 Dyrcona I think I got into programming because it was kind of like being a wizard. :)
11:36 * phasefx torments Dyrcona with source files mixed with tabs and non-tabs for indentation
11:36 Dyrcona pfft... parts of Evergreen are still like that.
11:37 phasefx need some stronger stuff, eh
11:37 csharp @quote add <+Dyrcona> I think I got into programming because it was kind of like being a wizard. :)
11:37 pinesol csharp: The operation succeeded.  Quote #203 added.
11:37 * miker reads up... csharp/mmorgan: just an FYI, the marc file that's uploaded is not sent through opensrf itself but stored in a temp location. then it's opened and processed a record a time via opensrf calls
11:37 Dyrcona Now, do that with Python and you've got a real problem.
11:37 csharp miker: good to know
11:37 miker (not that file size shouldn't be a consideration -- there are apache/nginx limits that need to be respected or adjusted)
11:38 * csharp starts git branch to port all Perl to Raku
11:38 Dyrcona Actually, Python indentation is one place where I find Emacs falls short.
11:38 * mmorgan nods
11:38 miker (and the temp location is named in opensrf.xml, and needs to be shared among all servers)
11:38 csharp s/Emacs/Python/ :-)
11:38 miker csharp: aren't you about a week late on that one? :)
11:38 csharp miker: did I miss something?
11:39 miker csharp: the raku port, I mean
11:39 * miker was typing too slow
11:39 Dyrcona Um, someone's trying to rewrite our Perl 5 in Raku?
11:39 Dyrcona I was gonna joke about it, but.....
11:40 miker I ... thought csharp was joking, actually ... no?
11:40 Dyrcona csharp: Indentation is easy to manage in Emacs if you know what you're doing. I guess vim offers no assistance, so that makes it easier. :)
11:40 csharp I am totally joking - thought miker was referring to someone actually starting such a branch
11:40 Dyrcona miker: OK. I thought so, too, but your "week late" comment threw me.
11:40 Dyrcona What csharp said. :)
11:41 Dyrcona April Fool's! :)
11:41 miker oh, just, you know, april 1...
11:41 csharp ooohhhhhhh
11:41 miker :)
11:42 csharp if it were April 1, my joke would've been about porting EG to Windows Server/Oracle/IIS
11:42 Dyrcona I've been saying about Raku what I said about Python 20+ years ago, so that means I'll probably start using Raku in another 10 years or so.
11:42 csharp oh, and Java for the app layer'
11:42 * Dyrcona actually thinks Java for the app layer would be an improvement. I'm not so fond of Perl as I used to be.
11:44 Dyrcona Going back to Maxwell's Demon: There's too much "magic" or should I say, "voodoo?"
11:45 Dyrcona But, that happens on any large project after a while without very strict code standards.
11:51 csharp hmm - even with the libraries closed I'm seeing open-ils.actor drones getting maxxed out
11:58 Dyrcona csharp: I'll check my logs, but we have libraries still doing checkins and checkouts.
11:59 Dyrcona I haven't seen that for a while, but I also haven't looked, and we just added a 6th brick.
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12:03 Dyrcona Humbug: /bin/zgrep: -R: option not supported
12:09 Dyrcona csharp: Haven't run out of open-ils.actor drones in March or April. We have run out of a search, storage, cstore, and circ, the latter as recently as 3/22.
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12:39 jeffdavis csharp: re actor drones, do you have the fixes for bug 1848550 and bug 1854850 locally?
12:40 pinesol Launchpad bug 1848550 in Evergreen "Cache settings more aggressively in web client" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1848550
12:40 pinesol Launchpad bug 1854850 in Evergreen "Implement Angular IndexedDB shared worker client" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1854850
12:51 csharp jeffdavis: no, I don't have those - I'll look into applying them - thanks for the tip!
13:17 csharp jeffdavis: the top commit on https://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=working/Ev​ergreen.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/user/be​rick/lp1848550-cache-settings-no-cachedate (hard-coding the eg/staff/splash redirect) is conflicting with the fix on https://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=working​/Evergreen.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/u​ser/berick/lp1854850-ang-indexeddb-coms
13:18 csharp jeffdavis: which did you go with on your live system?
13:19 csharp for reference, here is the git conflict in Open-ILS/src/eg2/src/app/staff/login.component.ts  https://pastebin.com/zVY2G6rG
13:20 Dyrcona csharp: That's easy, go with the HEAD block.
13:20 csharp Dyrcona: ok - thanks
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13:21 Dyrcona Well..... Either won't hurt. :)
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13:35 jeffdavis csharp: I believe we're just using my two original commits in production, not Bill's improvements
13:35 jeffdavis fwiw
13:38 JBoyer FYI, vim can "help" with indentation and whatnot, though I'm only reminded of that fact when it's enabled and I don't want it to be. (Same with multiline comments. makes pastes extra "fun")
13:39 Dyrcona I admit the indentation defaults for Emacs are dumb. It will mix spaces and tabs.
13:40 Dyrcona But, being able to "write" hundreds of thousands of line of code with just a couple of key strokes is worth it.
13:57 jeffdavis You generate that much code with Emacs macros?
13:58 Dyrcona Well, commands that I've written, but yes.
13:58 Dyrcona I get some data in a CSV, run a command and bam!
14:00 Dyrcona Most common things I've automated that generate lots of code: 1) add stat cats to new members' copies, 2) asset.call_number label updates, and 3) call number prefix and suffix deletes/changes.
14:01 Dyrcona A tiny bit of Lisp goes a long way.
14:01 jeffdavis ah
14:02 Dyrcona Macros, sometimes, too, but usually not so much.
14:02 Dyrcona Saving macros to us again later is another nice feature, but I don't use it that much.
14:03 Dyrcona I use a lot of skeletons, too. They're basically templates that can be used to start code files, or even wrap around existing code to add boilerplate.
14:04 Dyrcona These are some that I've shared: https://github.com/Dyrcona/evergreen2019-preconfe​rence/blob/master/examples/evergreen-skeletons.el
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14:10 Dyrcona Skeletons rock. It's like having template toolkit in your editor.
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14:35 csharp jeffdavis: berick: fwiw, I applied both of your sets of fixes from bug 1848550 and bug 1854850 to PINES - all good so far
14:35 pinesol Launchpad bug 1848550 in Evergreen "Cache settings more aggressively in web client" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1848550
14:35 pinesol Launchpad bug 1854850 in Evergreen "Implement Angular IndexedDB shared worker client" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1854850
14:37 Dyrcona Anyone else getting reports of Z39.50 not returning results from remote servers all of a sudden?
14:38 csharp Dyrcona: nothing in our helpdesk or cataloging mailing list
14:39 Dyrcona We just had a ticket opened, I'm checking our logs, but the noizzzze.
14:39 Dyrcona Out ticket says it is only returning local results.
14:41 Dyrcona It's not even trying. It returns way too fast.
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14:43 Dyrcona osrfsys.14.log:2020-04-07 14:42:36 bd1-bh2 open-ils.search: [INFO:15058:Z3950.pm:445:1586284826918114] z3950: 'noble' search returned 0 hits
14:44 Dyrcona Not very useful.
14:45 jeffdavis Can you search the servers "manually" i.e. using a client other than EG?
14:50 Dyrcona yaz-client says it can't resolve one of the host names.
14:53 Dyrcona Looks like the main DNS server is down and it's not trying the secondary nor tertiary for lookups.
15:03 * Dyrcona calls it a day.
15:14 berick great, thanks csharp.  mind noting in LP?
15:15 berick well maybe you are giving it more time..
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15:59 csharp berick: I will give it a couple of days, then add comments
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17:10 stompro_ Can someone help me remember, if we needed to switch to local holds only, is that a targeting setting? (Only fill holds with items a pickup location).
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17:12 jihpringle stompro_ I think it depends on whether you want people to still be able to place the non-local holds
17:15 jihpringle for our libraries we adjusted the hard boundary (in the library settings) and blocked reciprocal borrowing in the hold policies so patrons couldn't place ILL holds anymore
17:15 stompro_ jihpringle, thanks
17:15 jihpringle np
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