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IRC log for #evergreen, 2017-10-19

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Time Nick Message
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06:00 pinesol_green News from qatests: Test Success <http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live>
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08:10 csharp dbwells++
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08:59 Dyrcona So thing have improved more after the analyze, but I still see those queries running for up to 6 seconds.
09:00 Dyrcona At least, that's the time I was able to catch with a couple of spot checks.
09:01 Dyrcona OK. I just saw one go for 19+ seconds, so likely nothing has improved over changing the actor.org_unit_descendants function.
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10:55 berick just had 2 browser client tabs stay logged in over night.  it's polling session validity by calling open-ils.auth.session.retrieve, but that API resets the timeout.  may need to give session.retrieve a no-reset option for read-only checks or create an alterate "session.exists" API.  wonder why that doesn't affect the xul client...
10:55 * berick returns to this later
11:01 miker berick: IIRC, xul doesn't poll, it just notices on an action or page load and kicks you out, no? (I looked for a setTimeout-based poll, didn't see one at a glance, but could have missed)
11:10 Dyrcona No, xul doesn't poll. Maybe the web staff client shouldn't either?
11:12 * mmorgan would prefer knowing upfront that the auth session had expired, rather than only being told when attempting to do something that required authorization.
11:12 berick yeah, i think you're right.  thing is, we don't want to leave a browser tab open w/ sensitive data, hence the polling.
11:13 Dyrcona A number (most?) back end calls that check perms also do a session retrieve. I believe that is intentional.
11:14 berick i guess the xul client also has the optional idle timeout, that causes it to minimize
11:14 Dyrcona You don't find out in the XUL client that your session has timed out until you try to do something.
11:15 mmorgan Right, which is very confusing for staff.
11:16 berick yeah, we're not going back to that
11:16 mmorgan If the web client timed out, IMO it should return to a login prompt.
11:16 berick mmorgan: that's what it's supposed to do now.  the implementation just needs some help.
11:17 Dyrcona Trouble with that is, the session is managed by the server, so as berick said earlier, we'd need to poll with an option to not reset the session start time.
11:17 Dyrcona Of have a push notification of some kind. Remember those? :)
11:17 mmorgan Yes, I've seen that, and it makes logical sense.
11:18 Dyrcona Yay! Now staff are complaining about the issue I'm seeing in the database with the mk_copy_query SQL.
11:19 csharp working on bug 1724321 - does anyone have pointers on where duplicate TCN detection happens - in the perl layer?
11:19 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1724321 in Evergreen "Web Client -- existence of record with duplicate TCN does not prevent import" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1724321
11:20 * csharp can't see anything in Open-ILS/web/js/ui/default/staff/cat/z3950/app.js that looks like it happens there
11:20 mmorgan Dyrcona: What do staff see in the client when they hit that query problem?
11:21 berick csharp: Cat/BibCommon.pm
11:21 Dyrcona See? They just complain it takes 30+ seconds to load a record.
11:21 csharp berick: thanks - I'll have a look
11:21 Dyrcona I'm gonna see if I can mangle the JSON query into something that produces the faster query that miker pasted yesterday.
11:22 Dyrcona csharp: What Pg version are you on? I know NOBLE is on 9.4.
11:23 * Dyrcona wonders if this is a 9.5 thing....
11:24 * Dyrcona is tempted to just grab the ticket, but I'll let libapps staff assign it to me. :)
11:25 Dyrcona Is there a method call that will return the SQL from a JSON query? That would be mighty handy about now.
11:25 Dyrcona I know I can convert JSON to Perl and vice versa....
11:29 csharp Dyrcona: we're on 9.4
11:29 csharp upgrading to 9.5 next month
11:30 Dyrcona So, maybe it is a 9.5 planner thing?
11:30 Dyrcona I mentioned earlier that the analyze didn't help this query.
11:30 Dyrcona So, guess I'll make a branch this afternoon and try fixing it.
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11:47 miker Dyrcona: IIRC, dbwells had a reformulation of the query that made acn the core table, which in turn caused it to always come first in the join tree, and then the where clause go the record filter and it was applied first, making the query fast.  it think that caused problems for uses of the Util.pm function -- the FROM clause structure changed and required adjustments elsewhere throughout other modules like circ
11:48 Dyrcona miker: Thanks. I had forgotten that the branch is on the bug.
11:48 Dyrcona I also wonder why this doesn't seem to be a problem on our training server. It is also running Pg 9.5.
11:49 Dyrcona Unless we're just more patient with training. :)
11:50 Dyrcona Oh, right. Not a branch. jeff has a branch on a different bug.
11:51 miker ah, sorry. from memory :)
11:51 miker jeff++
11:52 Dyrcona Ah ha!
11:54 Dyrcona Before I do anything drastic, I'm going to change where I set PERL_HASH_SEED=0 to PERL_PERTURB_KEYS=0
11:54 Dyrcona Reading the release notes makes that seem like a better option.
11:54 Dyrcona Not sure that will really help, but seems like it's worth a shot.
11:59 dbwells I think PERL_HASH_SEED=0 sets PERL_PERTURB_KEYS to 0 as well :(
12:01 Dyrcona Yeah, so say the release notes.
12:17 dbwells Also, I think us setting the HASH_SEED just makes the order predictable, it doesn't give us back the old order.  As far as I can tell, only the PERL_HASH_FUNC_ONE_AT_A_TIME_OLD compile flag can do that.
12:17 Dyrcona Yeah.
12:18 Dyrcona Also jeffdavis++ I wrongly implicated jeff above. :)
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12:50 jeffdavis for the branch mentioned above: bug 1499086
12:50 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1499086 in Evergreen "Slowness/timeout on loading bookbags in OPAC" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1499086
12:57 Dyrcona Not seeing how I can force the join order with JSON queries, I'm going to try gmcharlt's squashed version of jeffdavis's branch.
13:09 dbwells Dyrcona: Just curious, did you try bumping up the join_collapse_limit?
13:09 Dyrcona No. I didn't.
13:11 Dyrcona Trouble is. I don't have a comparable db to production to test with. My testing systems always seem slow.
13:11 dbwells Ultimately that's all we did to work around it when bug 1527731 bit us.  Not sure what our overall penalty spread for doing that has been, but things are fast enough.
13:11 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1527731 in OpenSRF "Query for OPAC copies can be extremely slow" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1527731
13:12 Dyrcona dbwells: What, exactly, did you set?
13:13 * Dyrcona loves getting to stack overflow posts that say... Read this link... I click link, 404 or dns failure. :)
13:15 dbwells Dyrcona: Yeah, that bug report is a little dense.  We set 'join_collapse_limit' in the PG configuration to 9 or 10 (from the default of 8), as mentioned in "Solution #1".  Doing so has clear drawbacks (as also mentioned), but like I said, I don't really know the scale of the penalty.
13:18 dbwells Just double-checked, we just have ours at 9.  It was targeted to that one case, since it has 9 joins, so not really a broad solution.
13:18 dbwells But at least makes the edge cases a little smaller :)
13:19 dbwells Plus, I haven't followed closely whether your issue is intermittent or constant, so maybe it doesn't really apply.
13:20 Dyrcona dbwells: It seems constant.
13:20 Dyrcona Or, at least, constant enough. :)
13:22 Dyrcona I'll try join_collapse_limit on my test db and see if it affects the plan on the slow version of the query.
13:24 * dbwells tries to read up a bit more
13:25 Dyrcona I can just "set join_collapse_limit = 9;" right?
13:26 dbwells I think so.
13:27 kmlussier mmorgan++ #She knows why.
13:29 csharp @marc 003
13:29 pinesol_green csharp: The MARC code for the organization whose control number is contained in field 001 (Control Number). []
13:29 Dyrcona It works, but the setting doesn't stick around if I just do the set like that.
13:29 Dyrcona It seems to only affect the current connection.
13:30 dbwells Dyrcona: yes, that's true
13:30 dbwells Sorry if I misunderstood.
13:30 Dyrcona I'll have to change the config and reload to make it permanent, it looks like.
13:30 Dyrcona dbwells: No problem. :)
13:31 Dyrcona Just stating what I see for the logs, etc.
13:34 Dyrcona dbwells++
13:35 dbwells Another interesting technique I learned recently is using join_collapse_limit = 1 to force the plan to execute the joins in the order given.  Doesn't help when the root problem is not being able to control the requested join order at all, but could still come in handy.
13:35 Dyrcona So, making that change on my test db server dropped the execution time of my "bad" query from 40-41 seconds to 13 milliseconds.
13:35 Dyrcona dbwells: Yes, I saw that in the docs and in a stackoverflow question.
13:36 Dyrcona And a mailing list post maybe....
13:36 dbwells Yeah, Erwin Brandstetter?  Gotta love that guy :)
13:36 Dyrcona heh
13:37 dbwells Don't know how he can answer so many Stack Overflow PG questions with those squinty eyes, though...
13:40 * kmlussier now feels compelled to Google Erwin Brandstetter
13:41 kmlussier His eyes are indeed very squinty.
13:43 dbwells :D  I certainly mean no disrespect, the guy is a hero in my book.
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13:53 csharp so as my comment on bug 1724321 says, if (after setting cat.bib.use_id_for_tcn = false) I search z39.50, select a record with an already existing TCN, then click Import, I get blocked from importing (but bug 1724885 keeps me from knowing that until I view the logs)
13:53 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1724321 in Evergreen "Web Client -- existence of record with duplicate TCN does not prevent import" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1724321
13:53 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1724885 in Evergreen "web client: z39.50 import button does nothing when TCN already exists" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1724885
13:54 csharp but if I click "Edit then Import" it takes me to a generic MARC editor that doesn't know that I care about duplicated TCNs
13:54 csharp i.e., it's no longer an "import" but a "save what I have here as a new record"
13:54 csharp even though the label says "Import"
13:55 csharp <button class="btn btn-primary" ng-click="saveRecord()">{{ saveLabel || "[% l('Save') %]"}}</button>
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13:58 tspindler EOB meeting will start in a few minutes
14:01 tspindler #startmeeting 2017-10-19 - Evergreen Oversight Board Meeting
14:01 pinesol_green Meeting started Thu Oct 19 14:01:01 2017 US/Eastern.  The chair is tspindler. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:01 pinesol_green Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
14:01 pinesol_green The meeting name has been set to '2017_10_19___evergreen_oversight_board_meeting'
14:01 tspindler #topic roll call
14:01 tspindler Use the #info command stating name and affiliation
14:01 tspindler #info tspinder from C/W MARS
14:01 rfrasur #info rfrasur is Ruth Frasur, Hagerstown Library, Evergreen Indiana
14:01 collum #info collum is Garry Collum, Kenton County Public Library
14:01 rgagnon #info rgagnon is Ron Gagnon, North Of Boston Library Exchange (NOBLE)
14:01 ScottThomas #info scottthomas is Scott Thomas from PaILS
14:01 hbrennan #info hbrennan is Holly Brennan, Homer Public Library, AK
14:01 terran #info terran is Terran McCanna, PINES
14:02 sherbertbc #info sherbertbc is Sharon Herbert, Sitka/BCLC
14:02 gmcharlt #info gmcharlt = Galen Charlton, Equinox, 3.0 release manager and observer
14:03 tspindler #info Agenda
14:03 tspindler #link  https://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.​php?id=governance:minutes:2017-10-19
14:03 tspindler #minutes of September 21, 2017
14:03 tspindler #link  http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2017/evergreen.2017-09-21-14.01.html
14:03 tspindler Any corrections or comments on the minutes?
14:04 rfrasur not from me
14:04 tspindler Is there a motion to accept the minutes?
14:04 rgagnon #info Move to approve September minutes
14:04 terran #info Second
14:05 tspindler #startvote Approve minutes of 9-21-17? Yes, No, Abstain
14:05 pinesol_green Begin voting on: Approve minutes of 9-21-17? Valid vote options are Yes, No, Abstain.
14:05 pinesol_green Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts.
14:05 tspindler #vote Yes
14:05 hbrennan #vote Yes
14:05 rgagnon #vote Yes
14:05 collum #vote yes
14:05 ScottThomas #vote Yes
14:05 terran #vote Yes
14:05 sherbertbc #vote Yes
14:05 rfrasur #vote yes
14:05 tspindler #endvote
14:05 pinesol_green Voted on "Approve minutes of 9-21-17?" Results are
14:05 pinesol_green Yes (8): tspindler, rgagnon, collum, rfrasur, ScottThomas, terran, hbrennan, sherbertbc
14:06 tspindler #topic Report of the Chair
14:06 tspindler #info It Takes a Village: Open Source Forum
14:07 tspindler The following is my initial report I sent out and Galen asked me about putting something on the Evergreen Blog so we will be doing that.
14:07 tspindler #link http://list.evergreen-ils.org/pipermail/eg​-oversight-board/2017-October/001880.html
14:07 tspindler Overall, I thought it was a good experience.
14:07 terran I'm glad you went
14:08 tspindler It was interesting the variety of ways different projects are managed.
14:08 tspindler Does anyone have any questions or comments about the forum?
14:09 tspindler The forum also got me thinking about Evergreen of course and what we do well and maybe some things we don't do so well.
14:09 rgagnon tspindler: +1
14:10 tspindler I talked to kmlussier a little about this the other day but I think we should provide an opportunity at the conference to discuss ways to think strategically about Evergreens direction.
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14:11 tspindler My understanding is there have been some of this in the past but I was thinking it would be good to carve out time at the conference every year.
14:11 ScottThomas I think this is a good idea. Also, a lot of the people at the conference may not even know how Evergreen is managed.
14:12 kmlussier Yes, we did something similar at the Camrbidge conference where we used space at Google to discuss strategic directions for the project. It was scheduled a day before the hack-a-way.
14:12 tspindler It would have to involve a variety of stake holders
14:12 hbrennan I'll admit that I knew close to nothing about the management side until my first EOB mtg
14:12 ScottThomas Same here.
14:13 terran I think it's a good idea to make it a standing session each year.
14:13 tspindler If the board is ok I'll ask the program committee about this.
14:13 tspindler terran +1
14:13 terran I'm on the program committee and I'll vote yes :D
14:13 collum Me too.
14:13 ScottThomas I think it is a really good idea.
14:13 rgagnon I agree
14:13 * rfrasur agrees
14:14 terran The last few years have been so focused on getting the web client ready to use, it's been difficult to think about anything beyond that.
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14:14 tspindler #action tspindler will discuss with the conference program committee about a standing program on Evergreen direction
14:15 tspindler If anyone has any thoughts on how it should be structured, just send me an email.
14:15 ScottThomas I also think we need to have an Evergreen Organization Basics type of session.
14:15 tspindler what would that encompass?
14:16 terran Perhaps build time into the beginning of the EOB meeting to do an overview?
14:16 ScottThomas How open source projects are managed and how Evergreen itself is managed? What is its history? Who and what is the EOB? What is its role?
14:17 tspindler terran: do you mean to do this as part of an orientation for new board members?
14:17 ScottThomas How does open source management differ from how propietrary software is managed?
14:18 rgagnon And that there's no "them/they" ("When are they going to....") but only "us/we" for the general session.
14:18 ScottThomas I think a lot of attendees in general would like a basic intro. I would have jumped at it my first year.
14:18 terran tspindler: both that and for anyone else who shows up out of curiosity. I attended a couple of EOB meetings before I ever joined the board and it would have been helpful to me
14:18 tspindler #info suggestion to have a regular session at the annual conference on Evergreen Organization Basics to cover how how Evergreen is managed and how it differs from proprietary systems among other things
14:19 * kmlussier thinks this sounds similar to the Intro to the Community program we've done in previous years.
14:19 ScottThomas Yes and I am willing to submit a proposal to the program committee.
14:19 terran Yes, it could cover a lot of the same ground
14:20 tspindler #action: tspindler will include on the conference EOB meeting an orientation component about the history of Evergreen and how it is managed
14:22 tspindler kmlussier: I can't remember but is the intro to the community done every year, I thought it was but I'm not sure
14:22 terran I believe it's only been done when someone submits it as a proposal
14:22 kmlussier tspindler: I don't recall seeing it last year, but I think it happened the previous three years.
14:23 collum I don't believe there was one last year.
14:23 kmlussier Yes, what terran said. It relies on somebody submitting a proposal.
14:23 ScottThomas I'll submit a proposal.
14:23 terran If we make it a standing session, we can just have it led by the EOB chair each year
14:23 tspindler I think it would be a good idea to have it as a standing session
14:24 kmlussier It's nice to get a few panelists to help with that one, who can cover different parts of the community.
14:24 tspindler Could there be one standing session on the the intro and direction discussion?
14:24 terran Agreed on panelists, but if we have a designated person leading it, then it could be understood that that person has to do the panelist herding (terran loves volunteering other people to do things)
14:25 collum terran++
14:25 tspindler terran: I could see that as a standing duty of the EOB Chair
14:25 rgagnon Would the intro and direction each appeal to different audiences -- newbies vs. established?
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14:26 ScottThomas Yes. I think so.
14:26 tspindler rgagnon: i could see it being different audiences
14:26 terran There would be some overlap - especially from libraries who aren't on Evergreen and considering it as an option
14:27 terran Maybe two back to back sessions?
14:27 collum I agree
14:27 kmlussier I'm just going to throw my two cents in as a non-Board member, but I think the strategic direction discussion would work better as something outside the normal program block. Something that allows for more time.
14:28 kmlussier I'm not sure if that's really doable for this year since the space is already reserved, but something to think about for the future.
14:28 gmcharlt allows for more time - and broader participation; i.e., I'd suggest it would be worth ensuring there were no competing programs
14:29 tspindler ScottThomas: I'm assuming you will talk about a program to the committee and I can at least talk to them about a strategic direction discussion to find out what is and isn't possible
14:31 tspindler #action tspindler will talk to the conference committee/program committee about the possibilities of a slot or location for a strategic discussion
14:31 tspindler #topic Financial report
14:31 tspindler #link https://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?i​d=governance:financials:update_2017_09_21
14:32 tspindler Are there any questions?  gmcharlt send something out a little while ago on this.
14:33 tspindler #topic SFC Updates
14:33 tspindler I don't think Amy is online.  I don't have any information.
14:34 tspindler #topic Release Manager
14:34 tspindler I don't know if gmcharlt has any comments about 3.0 and the developers are soliciting volunteers for 3.1
14:35 tspindler #info Developers are soliciting nominations for a release manager
14:35 gmcharlt yep, that's the substance of what I was planning to say
14:35 rfrasur I know that one person, at least, has submitted themselves as a nomination.
14:36 tspindler #topic SFC Membership Review (Sharon Herbert, Scott Thomas and Tim Spindler)
14:36 tspindler before we get into the review of the two organizations.
14:37 tspindler #info tspindler will be talking to Michael Winkler of the Open Library Foundation on Monday, October 23
14:37 tspindler #link http://www.openlibraryfoundation.org/
14:38 tspindler I talked to someone connected with the Kuali Ole and now the Folio project at the "It Takes a Village forum".  They have formed a new organizaton, the Open Library Foundation.
14:38 tspindler The intent of this organization is to serve as an umbrella organization for open source/open access projects in libraries.
14:39 tspindler Currently, they only have the Folio project but are negotiating with VuFind.  My goal will be to find out what services they could provide for Evergreen.
14:39 tspindler They are a separate non-profit at this time.
14:39 kmlussier tspindler: I notice they specifically mention the Apache license on their about page http://www.openlibraryfoundation.org/about/
14:39 terran If I remember correctly, Kuali got restarted from scratch a year or so in, and then was finally scrapped last year - is that correct?
14:40 kmlussier Does it sound like they're open to other licenses?
14:40 sherbertbc_ kuali ole was about 8 years in the making before scrapping
14:41 tspindler kmlussier: yes i noticed that but my impression is they are open to us managing the project in our own way.  I think their goal is to provide resources for projects  and have a very hands off approach.
14:42 sherbertbc_ would be interested to know if they envision hiring any staff over time, as they are new and volunteer
14:43 tspindler Kuali Ole fell apart for a variety of reasons. One reason is that Kauli Foundation was a non-profit that changed over to a for-profit organization.
14:44 tspindler sherbertbc_: they are very new and I'm not sure how many services they can actually provide
14:45 tspindler Moving on to the work we have been doing.
14:45 sherbertbc_ Agreed, I think definitely good to chat with them anyway
14:45 tspindler Last month the board asked for some further cost anlaysis in comparing the two organizations we have been reviewing.
14:46 tspindler Amy has not provided me with any consts associated with leaving the SFC but my impression is the costs would be negligable but I'm not 100% certain
14:46 tspindler #info Organization 1 would be less expensive than Organization 2 (approximately half the cost; however if we form our own non-profit the costs rise to a cost similar to organization 2)
14:47 terran tspindler: do you have the link to the organization comparison chart handy?
14:49 tspindler #link https://docs.google.com/a/cwmars.org/s​preadsheets/d/1qGa72lPCmWKlkCrjj-hDunD​Hqho773P9p8WshhqjeDY/edit?usp=sharing
14:49 terran Thank you!
14:50 tspindler Both organizations offer pricing based on hourly usage.  One would cap the total at 10% of total revenues so it would never exceed what we pay to the SFC.  The other organization would be willing to negotiate a flat annual fee.
14:50 tspindler It is likely both organizations would be cheaper than the SFC.
14:51 tspindler sherbertbc_ and ScottThomas do you have any other comments
14:51 sherbertbc_ nothing to add
14:51 ScottThomas Nicely done.
14:52 sherbertbc_ Thanks to tspindler for doing the heavy lifting
14:52 ScottThomas tspindler++
14:52 terran tspindler++
14:52 tspindler One of our options could be move over to one of these organizations and then revisit creating a non-profit or moving to the Open Library Foundation at a futuer date
14:52 collum tspindler++ sherbertbc_++ ScottThomas++
14:53 terran sherbertbc_++ ScottThomas++
14:53 ScottThomas This sounds like a good plan since creating a 501c3 takes a bit of time.
14:53 terran Agreed
14:54 tspindler If we are to make the switch, we need something in place before conference contracts are signed for 2019
14:54 terran Question - I see that Org 1 said financials are available upon request. Were they requested and reviewed?
14:55 tspindler We have not requested the financials.
14:55 tspindler Would the board be prepared to make a final decision in November?
14:55 terran I would like to know if there are any red flags with the financials for either of them.
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14:56 tspindler We could request those and report back in November?
14:56 terran Works for me
14:56 rfrasur me too
14:56 rgagnon Sounds good
14:57 sherbertbc tspindler: sorry, my connection dropped, what are we requesting?
14:57 tspindler Financials
14:57 sherbertbc +1
14:57 collum +1
14:57 tspindler Once we report back, would everyone be prepared to make a decision or should we gather other information?
14:57 sherbertbc also, not sure if already answered: what's eta for 2019 conference signing?
14:58 tspindler Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but I would guess June or July of 2018?
14:58 kmlussier A lot of it depends on when you put out a call for proposals for hosting the 2019 conference.
14:59 ScottThomas Why are we not revealing the names of the two organizations?
14:59 tspindler kmlussier: has the board handled those calls?
14:59 rfrasur I think, Scott, because some of us might have unintended bias.
15:00 tspindler rfrasur: exactly
15:00 kmlussier tspindler: The Board usually kicks off the process. There is a site selection committee that usually handles the details.
15:00 tspindler kmlussier: I'll follow up off line then.
15:01 kmlussier Traditionally, it's timed so that contracts are signed around June / July, but I think it was earlier with Vancouver because the call went out a lot earlier.
15:01 tspindler We are at 3pm an hour into the meeeting
15:01 ScottThomas I understand about the unintended bias.
15:01 tspindler Can we extend for 5 minutes? I know kmlussier has a vote she needs
15:02 sherbertbc +1
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15:02 tspindler #action SFC Review task force will solicit financials from organizations
15:02 rfrasur I'm going to need to leave.
15:02 rgagnon +1
15:02 ScottThomas +1
15:02 rfrasur left #evergreen
15:02 tspindler #topic Outreach Committee (Kathy Lussier)
15:03 terran I understand about the bias, especially during the initial review. But I am also not comfortable voting between two companies without knowing who they are.
15:03 collum Yes.  The only thing that I have to report for the Conference Committee is that the Call for Program Proposals page is live.  Get those proposals in.
15:04 tspindler #info 2018 conference call for programs is live
15:04 tspindler I think the Outreach Committee is looking for up to $300 to refresh the logo
15:04 kmlussier I have nothing to add to what was in the e-mail.
15:04 hbrennan Apologies from me as well for being quite silent this mtg. I upgraded to 3.0 yesterday and I'm scrambling to pick up the bits and pieces today. And now I'm working the circ desk.
15:05 ScottThomas I move we approve $300 to refresh logo
15:05 terran I second.
15:05 tspindler #info ScottThomas moves to approve the $300 and terran seconds
15:06 tspindler #startvote Approve the Outreach Committee spending up to $300 to refresh the logo? Yes, No, Abstain
15:06 pinesol_green Begin voting on: Approve the Outreach Committee spending up to $300 to refresh the logo? Valid vote options are Yes, No, Abstain.
15:06 pinesol_green Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts.
15:06 terran #vote Yes
15:06 collum #vote Yes
15:06 tspindler #vote Yes
15:06 rgagnon #vote Yes
15:06 sherbertbc #vote Yes
15:06 ScottThomas #vote Yes
15:07 tspindler #endvote
15:07 pinesol_green Voted on "Approve the Outreach Committee spending up to $300 to refresh the logo?" Results are
15:07 pinesol_green Yes (6): tspindler, rgagnon, collum, ScottThomas, terran, sherbertbc
15:07 hbrennan #vote YES
15:07 hbrennan dang
15:07 hbrennan :)
15:07 kmlussier hbrennan: Well, we'll see it in the logs! :)
15:07 kmlussier Thanks everyone!
15:07 sherbertbc hbrennan: too slow ;)
15:08 terran hbrennan: I think you have a good excuse to be distracted today!
15:08 hbrennan sherbertbc: You should see how fast I'm moving in real life!
15:08 tspindler terran: I didn't want to ignore you comment about the vote next week and the organization names.  I think we can discuss it at the next meeting before we vote
15:08 sherbertbc hbrennan++
15:08 khuckins__ joined #evergreen
15:08 hbrennan Yesterday was Alaska Day so we were closed. Extra busy today :)
15:08 terran tspindler: That works for me. Reviewing the financials before knowing the names also works for me.
15:09 tspindler I don't have any other agenda items.  Do we have a motion to adjourn?
15:09 ScottThomas So moved
15:09 tspindler thanks all
15:09 sherbertbc tspindler++
15:09 tspindler #endmeeting
15:09 pinesol_green Meeting ended Thu Oct 19 15:09:48 2017 US/Eastern.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
15:09 pinesol_green Minutes:        http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2017/evergreen.2017-10-19-14.01.html
15:09 pinesol_green Minutes (text): http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2017/evergreen.2017-10-19-14.01.txt
15:09 pinesol_green Log:            http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergree​n/2017/evergreen.2017-10-19-14.01.log.html
15:09 collum tspindler++
15:09 rgagnon tspindler++
15:09 kmlussier tspindler++
15:10 terran Thanks everyone! tspindler++
15:10 ScottThomas tspindler++
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15:20 Dyrcona OMG.....Looking through logs can be scary. You sometimes find things unrelated to what you're looking for that you wish you hadn't.
15:21 Dyrcona Like staff adding what should be a note/alert to a patron's default hold notification phone number.
15:22 tspindler Dyrcona: it is fascinating the way some staff use patron fields...let us say creatively
15:23 Dyrcona "Fascinating" in the sense that Spock used the word. :)
15:23 tspindler Yes
15:23 rhamby Dyrcona: there's a lovecraftian joke to make in there somewhere as in "don't read the logs" instead of "don't read the book"
15:24 Dyrcona rhamby++
15:24 Dyrcona And, it doesn't help that messages seem to be missing.
15:25 Dyrcona I can find an authtoken, but no sign of the auth transactions when they logged in, so I can't easily tell who it was.
15:25 Dyrcona I'm chasing down an issue with a library failing to update copy templates that I believe is the result of a bundling/chunking bug.
15:27 dbwells Well, auth service data is generally redacted, though there is still usually ways to piece things together.
15:27 Dyrcona I'm mainly concerned about the work ou.
15:27 Dyrcona I did the open-ils.auth open-ils.auth.session.delete at 2:33, but that's not very helpful.
15:28 mmorgan joined #evergreen
15:28 Dyrcona Based on other messages in the logs, they logged in around 14:20.
15:29 Dyrcona Whole buncha these: open-ils.auth.session.retrieve
15:30 Dyrcona rsyslog stinks....
15:34 Dyrcona They logged in on brick3 and I found it in brick 3's logs.
15:34 Dyrcona Brick 3 is logging to the syslog server, but I guess messages get dropped.
15:40 Dyrcona The upshot is that I'm pretty sure there are still bundling/chunking bugs with one of the gateways, but I'm not sure which one, yet.
15:40 Dyrcona Looks like sending too much data to the server in a single message is a problem.
15:41 Dyrcona osrf_json_gw
15:42 Dyrcona 2017-10-19 12:29:14 bh1 osrf_json_gw: [WARN:17430:transport_sessi​on.c:869:15084303931743017] Text of error message received from Jabber: XML stanza is too big
15:51 tspindler left #evergreen
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16:16 Bmagic Whats up with the reporting engine adding "is null or" onto the query where I plainly specify that I want active=false on actor.usr?
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16:38 kmlussier @dessert [someone]
16:38 kmlussier Do I have a leading space again?
16:38 kmlussier @dessert [someone]
16:38 * pinesol_green grabs some Mint Chocolate Chip Ice Cream for jihpringle
16:38 berick Bmagic: IIRC there's a null check toggle for that somewhere in the UI.
16:39 berick yeah, "Nullability"
16:39 Bmagic berick: I don't have it checked, but I think I figured it out. It was apples and oranges. Thought it was filtering on active but it was actor.card.isactive
16:39 jihpringle yum, thanks kmlussier
16:39 mmorgan @decide nullability or Mint Chocolate Chip Ice Cream
16:39 pinesol_green mmorgan: go with Mint Chocolate Chip Ice Cream
16:39 mmorgan That's what I was thinking.
16:40 kmlussier pinesol_green: Good choice!
16:40 berick Bmagic: *nod*
16:40 pinesol_green kmlussier: Thank you kmlussier! But our princess is in another castle!
16:40 jeffdavis Does the princess have the ice cream?
16:40 kmlussier heh
16:42 pinesol_green [evergreen|Dan Wells] Forward-port 3.0.1 upgrade script - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=9cf4d05>
16:55 kmlussier My cat has gotten in the habit of climbing on my keyboard right around 5 p.m. It's as if he can tell time and knows that I should stop working.
16:56 mmorgan I'll bet his stomach can tell time.
16:56 mmorgan That's true in my house.
16:57 Bmagic This is something new to me "MERGED_USER_IN_COLLECTIONS" - Searching the code it's an error that you receive when merging two patrons AND one of those appear in the money.collections_tracker table! Never seen this table!? What is the resolution? Select the opposite account as the winner?
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17:25 kmlussier Bmagic: Unfortunately, I know very little about collections.
17:26 Bmagic kmlussier: no problem, I think I just wanted to bounce it around here. I decided to say that "there isn't a way to merge them" - first you have to remove the patron from collections
17:49 bshum dbwells++ # behind the scenes i18n detective work
18:01 pinesol_green News from qatests: Test Success <http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live>
18:44 jvwoolf left #evergreen
19:21 csharp Dyrcona: check auditor.actor_usr_history for the audit_usr for the weird patron edit
19:22 Dyrcona csharp: I think that was meant for Bmagic.
19:22 csharp Dyrcona: I was responding to your field-abusing staff member you saw in the logs :-)
19:23 Dyrcona Oh! :)
19:23 Dyrcona I'm fixing max_stanza_size at the moment...one brick at a time, then cookie dough ice cream. :)
19:23 csharp heh
19:26 csharp Bmagic: the report query builder adds IS NULL OR onto any query that filters on a source that left joins by default ("might_have" in the fieldmapper, iirc)
19:28 csharp Bmagic: re: MERGED_USER_IN_COLLECTIONS yeah, the collections user (which is determined by having a penalty attached to the account) has to be the lead account in the merge, and we also just bounce it back to the libraries for resolution before merging
19:29 stephengwills left #evergreen
19:29 csharp Dyrcona: I also suspect another chunking bug - we're still having problems with z39.50 imports after upgrading opensrf to 2.5.2
19:30 Dyrcona csharp: We don't import much with z39.50, so I have no reports of that.
19:31 Dyrcona I plain to open a Lp bug tomorrow with all the log messages I can find related to the one I shared earlier.
19:31 Dyrcona I'll look for other instances of XML stanza is too big while I'm at it.
20:51 pinesol_green [evergreen|Galen Charlton] forward-port 2.12.7 upgrade script - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=871e6d8>
21:01 gmcharlt https://evergreen-ils.org/everg​reen-2-12-7-and-3-0-1-released/

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