Evergreen ILS Website

IRC log for #evergreen, 2017-10-05

| Channels | #evergreen index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary | Join Webchat

All times shown according to the server's local time.

Time Nick Message
06:01 pinesol_green News from qatests: Test Success <http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live>
07:15 rjackson_isl joined #evergreen
07:21 agoben joined #evergreen
07:32 Dyrcona joined #evergreen
07:50 csharp Bmagic: I'm interested in the results of your test as well - that's a long-standing source of confusion for our libraries
08:03 collum joined #evergreen
08:27 Dyrcona So, no one uses retarget local holds when checking in new copies?
08:28 * Dyrcona just got caught up with the logs.
08:30 JBoyer We make that suggestion when it comes up, yeah. Sometimes people forget to turn it off or their workflows are so basic that there isn't a "check in the new item" step...
08:30 _adb joined #evergreen
08:35 mmorgan joined #evergreen
08:41 Dyrcona FYI: I had some fun with my firewall/router at home again last night, so I may just disappear for no apparent reason.
08:42 mmorgan We advocate using the retargeting checkin modifiers when checking in new copies, but there is still confusion. And as JBoyer notes, sometimes the checkin modifiers get left on.
08:42 Dyrcona I think I know what the problem is, have it isolated for now, and have a replacement part on the way.
08:43 * Dyrcona knows all about the confusion: "Tracy told us not to use that modifier." "You don't want to use it all the time, just when checking in new copies."
08:43 Dyrcona And, I think they actually said "never" instead of "not," but memory is fuzzy.
08:45 Dyrcona And, I know all about workflows....People using yellowed notebooks with workflows from 2 ILS in the past....
08:46 Dyrcona No wonder they thought Horizon and then Evergreen sucked....They were still using GEAC.
08:46 Dyrcona :)
08:47 mmorgan For some reason folks think that when they checkin a new copy, it should just trigger the hold. ;-)
08:47 Dyrcona And, it should all happen instantaneously, despite the complexity of what they ask.
08:48 mmorgan Exactly!
08:48 * Dyrcona gives "them" a lollipop.
08:57 Dyrcona Checkin already does too much in my opinion.
08:57 mmorgan More than it needs to?
08:59 Dyrcona Possibly, but I think you'd be surprised what happens with checkin and renew if you run it with the Perl debugger.
08:59 Dyrcona I think sometimes users ask for too much, then wonder why it's slow.
09:00 mmorgan I do notice a lot of activity related to Bookings which seems unnecessary.
09:00 Dyrcona It's more than just that. Renewal will attempt to calculate fines twice.
09:01 mmorgan For any good reason?
09:01 Dyrcona You can disable the booking stuff, though maybe not completely.
09:02 Dyrcona Not that I can tell. The checkin does it, then the renew code does it again. The second time should come up with 0.
09:03 Dyrcona I haven't been able to the debugger to work since somewhere around OpenSRF 2.4. I think some changes there made it not work.
09:03 Dyrcona It was already difficult enough since OpenSRF forks a lot of processes.
09:03 Dyrcona It might have been earlier than 2.4 that it stopped working for me altogether.
09:08 Dyrcona BTW, Python appears to be broken with OpenSRF/Evergreen 3.0. If you're using Syrup that might be a reason not to upgrade, yet.
09:08 Dyrcona I should look at that some more. Guess I've got time today.
09:08 * Dyrcona waits on bandwidth-limited files to copy.
09:08 mmorgan That sounds bad :-(
09:09 Dyrcona All I can say is, if I start srfsh.py, it blows up.
09:10 Dyrcona Guess I haven't made a Lp bug, yet.
09:18 yboston joined #evergreen
09:19 kmlussier joined #evergreen
09:22 kmlussier Is there any reason why Syrup can't stay on old OpenSRF while the Evergreen installation upgrades to new OpenSRF?
09:24 Dyrcona There are things about syrup that I do not understand.
09:24 Dyrcona i.e. most of it.
09:25 Dyrcona It appears to need an Evergreen installation to talk to via the gateway, yet doesn't work unless services are also running locally.
09:27 * Dyrcona is going to install stock 3.0 on a test server with production data.
09:27 kmlussier No, I don't think that's true. NOBLE doesn't have Syrup running with an Evergreen installation. I'm pretty sure artunit told me it wasn't needed way back when.
09:27 Dyrcona All I can say is what I see in our installation which I did not set up and have had little to do with except upgrading the OpenSRF and Evergreen packages when we upgrade production.
09:28 Dyrcona Ours has configuration to use bark.cwmars.org and it wont' work unless I run services locally.
09:29 Dyrcona That's all I can say for certain at this time.
09:29 Dyrcona I did set up a test vm that uses itself, and the same appears to be true there.
09:29 Dyrcona Hopefully, we will soon abandon Syrup.
09:36 mdriscoll joined #evergreen
09:47 kmlussier I'm curious. Why is the new Overdrive functionality not recommended for production use without careful testing?
09:48 csharp hmm - 2017-10-05 09:15:42 utility03 open-ils.trigger: [WARN:25782:Client.pm:122:] Sending large message of 2544937 bytes to router@private.utility03.gapines.org/open-ils.trigger
09:48 Dyrcona 'Cause it hasn't been thoroughly tested, or at least not beyond Sitka.
09:48 csharp immediately after that, the client is gone from the jabber network
09:48 * Dyrcona is supposed to setup a test with Overdrive, but time.
09:50 csharp that's a PO JEDI a/t event, btw
09:51 Dyrcona csharp: Did the event complete with success and was it properly handled?
09:55 mdriscoll Regarding Syrup, NOBLE has opensrf 2.4.1 installed on our syrup server.  We are not even running opensrf services.  Syrup utilizes the opensrf libraries to talk to whatever evergreen server you point it at.  According to a comment in the code "It [Python OpenSRF library] isn't needed for our read-only ILS operations, only for updates."  So if you are not having Syrup make changes to Evergreen copies like copy location, I
09:57 Dyrcona mdriscoll: Apparently, we are using it for updates. I have not taken the time to study the code, and I can't trust the documentation.
09:57 mdriscoll ...I don't think you even need to install it.
09:57 Dyrcona I know that the comments and the README say, but that is not what happens in our specific case.
10:02 mmorgan1 joined #evergreen
10:17 Bmagic So, checking in an item with the "fill holds" modifier will update the action.hold_copy_map ?
10:18 Dyrcona No, I don't think so, but I haven't looked that modifier up specifically.
10:19 Dyrcona Retarget local holds will do what it says, retarget local holds related to that copy.
10:19 Dyrcona That will update the hold_copy_map.
10:20 Dyrcona You don't want to use it at a circ desk as part of your normal operation because it can be slow.
10:24 Bmagic The 2.12.6-3.0.0 version upgrade script stamps config.upgrade with '3.0-beta1' - is that right?
10:24 Bmagic http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=Evergreen.git;a=​blob;f=Open-ILS/src/sql/Pg/version-upgrade/2.12.​6-3.0.0-upgrade-db.sql;h=767e635f7535e577ed04a18​7796a3d30b0b58f45;hb=refs/heads/tags/rel_3_0_0
10:25 Dyrcona Bmagic: That's probably a mistake.
10:25 bshum Oops
10:26 Bmagic I thought it might be a mistake
10:26 Bmagic I haven't check the tarball
10:26 Bmagic check/checked
10:27 bshum It looks wrong in the git tag branch, so probably not right in the tarball either
10:32 miker csharp: is your max stanza size larger than 2.5MB? if not, that's the expected (if not strictly "good") behavior of ejabberd
10:54 Christineb joined #evergreen
11:00 mmorgan joined #evergreen
11:08 pinesol_green [evergreen|Kathy Lussier] Docs: ebook api release note entry and doc changes - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=e3c7d80>
11:09 kmlussier gmcharlt: Would you be able to update the release notes available from the Downloads page to incorporate the change I just made?
11:09 gmcharlt kmlussier: yea
11:09 kmlussier gmcharlt++
11:11 kmlussier gmcharlt: Actually, can you hold off on that? I just noticed a problem.
11:11 gmcharlt mine hand is now stopped, hovering over the enter key
11:11 gmcharlt ;)
11:14 kmlussier gmcharlt: OK, go!
11:14 kmlussier Sorry about that. I thought I had removed that heading in my first series of edits.
11:16 pinesol_green [evergreen|Kathy Lussier] Docs: remove electronic resources heading - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=7a2393c>
11:17 gmcharlt kmlussier: I have done the thing! I have hit the enter key!
11:18 kmlussier gmcharlt: Your hand must have gotten tired.
11:49 bshum joined #evergreen
11:53 bshum Whee, upgraded my quasselcore DB to newly released PG10 :)
11:54 bshum Now I want to see how much Evergreen explodes if I try it on PG10 too, heh
11:59 berick bshum++
12:10 jihpringle joined #evergreen
12:42 khuckins joined #evergreen
12:50 dwgreen joined #evergreen
13:11 rlefaive joined #evergreen
13:46 agoben joined #evergreen
13:50 agoben joined #evergreen
13:55 ohiojoe joined #evergreen
13:57 ohiojoe hello EG world
13:57 ohiojoe I believe there is a DIG meeting in less than 5 minutes..
13:57 jeffdavis ohiojoe: hello!
13:57 Dyrcona hello
13:58 Dyrcona That very well could be. I apparently don't subscribe to that calendar.
14:01 ohiojoe #startmeeting 2017-10-05 Documentation Interest Group Meeting
14:01 pinesol_green Meeting started Thu Oct  5 14:01:06 2017 US/Eastern.  The chair is ohiojoe. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:01 pinesol_green Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
14:01 pinesol_green The meeting name has been set to '2017_10_05_documentation_interest_group_meeting'
14:01 ohiojoe #topic introductions
14:01 sandbergja joined #evergreen
14:01 ohiojoe please use "#info <username> is <name> <affiliation>" to identify who you are and what organization, if any, you represent
14:02 ohiojoe #info ohiojoe is Joe Knueven, Germantown Public Library, Consortium of Ohio Libraries
14:07 ohiojoe @weather 45327
14:07 pinesol_green ohiojoe: Germantown, OH :: Rain :: 67F/19C | Thursday: Rain. Thunder possible. High 71F. Winds SW at 5 to 10 mph. Chance of rain 90%. Thursday Night: Partly cloudy skies this evening will become overcast overnight. Low 61F. Winds light and variable. | Updated: 12m ago
14:09 Dyrcona @weather
14:09 pinesol_green Dyrcona: Methuen, MA :: Clear :: 79F/26C | Thursday: Partly cloudy. High 79F. Winds W at 10 to 15 mph. Thursday Night: A few clouds. Low 57F. Winds light and variable.
14:09 ohiojoe Since this is being logged, I'm going to take the opportunity before closing the meeting to appologies to the DIG for not being on the ball with communicating out information about today's meeting.
14:10 Dyrcona Might be helpful to put the dates on the community calendar.
14:12 ohiojoe Dyrcona: That's a good suggestion, I just now realized that that is out there.   Sloowly but surely, I'll get the hang of this
14:13 ohiojoe Also, I need to see if I can get access to edit it, at first blush it looks like I don't have access..
14:13 ohiojoe #endmeeting
14:13 pinesol_green Meeting ended Thu Oct  5 14:13:36 2017 US/Eastern.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
14:13 pinesol_green Minutes:        http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2017/evergreen.2017-10-05-14.01.html
14:13 pinesol_green Minutes (text): http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2017/evergreen.2017-10-05-14.01.txt
14:13 pinesol_green Log:            http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergree​n/2017/evergreen.2017-10-05-14.01.log.html
14:17 ohiojoe Dyrcona:  Thank you again for the suggestion.  Have a good day
14:17 Dyrcona You, too!
14:17 kmlussier Oops! I forgot about the meeting and ran out to get a frappe.
14:18 kmlussier Also, ohiojoe has access to the DIG calendar. I'll send him an email.
14:21 Dyrcona Does the DIG calendar feed the community calendar?
14:21 kmlussier Dyrcona: yes
14:21 Dyrcona OK. I wasn't sure.
14:23 kmlussier For newer groups I've been involved in, like the web team and outreach, I've just posted events to the main community calendar rather than creating a new calendar that feeds into the community calendar.
14:27 khuckins_ joined #evergreen
14:28 kmlussier It's amazing how quickly a frappe can go down.
14:29 Dyrcona Yeah...
14:39 Bmagic Anyone have Hatch running on OSX?
14:39 Dyrcona No, but that reminds me again that I should build Hatch this weekend for production.
14:40 Dyrcona Unless we can use the one from training...
14:41 JBoyer Bmagic, can you even get a Java runtime for macOS anymore?
14:42 Bmagic oh yeah, there's that
14:42 bwicksall Yes, directly from Oracle I think
14:42 Dyrcona Be sure to only install the free stuff. You don't want a surprise bill from Oracle.
14:43 Bmagic in theory, I should be able to get java runtime running, and with homebrew build the linux one?
14:43 Dyrcona Bmagic: In theory....
14:44 Bmagic sounds like a fun adventure
14:45 Bmagic hatch could be installed on a linux machine on the same LAN, and the OSX machine could use that?
14:45 JBoyer I haven't touched Java in ages, but if you can get a free JDK for OS X I think you should be able to build Hatch without homebrew. If you're using homebrew you may be able to just use a jdk / jre from it (for all I know.)
14:46 JBoyer Bmagic, I don't know if that's the case anymore.
14:46 Bmagic I thought I had heard at some point that hatch was localhost only, but I wanted to double check
14:46 JBoyer I thought it was intended to be used on localhost with the Chrome native scripting plugin, but I haven't kept up very well.
14:48 Dyrcona It can be localhost or the server part can run on the LAN, IIANM.
14:48 Dyrcona Bmagic: It's a bit out of date, but there's this: https://wiki.openjdk.java.net/display/BSDPort/Main
14:48 Dyrcona Mac OS X is a flavor of BSD, after all.
14:49 Dyrcona You'll want OpenJDK 8 with JavaFX (for printing).
14:49 Bmagic https://code.google.com/ar​chive/p/openjdk-osx-build/
14:49 Bmagic lol
14:50 Dyrcona Note that has been moved to github.
14:50 Bmagic https://github.com/hgomez/obuildfactory/wi​ki/Building-and-Packaging-OpenJDK8-for-OSX
14:51 berick Bmagic: i've run Hatch on OSX and Linux.  JRE8.  it no longer supports server mode.  it's invoked directly from the Chrome extension via STDIN/STDOUT
14:52 Bmagic berick: good to know
14:52 Dyrcona Good to know that server mode is not a thing any more.
14:56 Dyrcona berick: If I built Hatch for training in late spring, is there any reason to build a new one for production?
14:57 berick Dyrcona: don't think so.  last bug fix commit was in Feb.
14:57 berick during the 2.12 push
14:58 Dyrcona That's what I thought. Thanks!
14:59 Dyrcona Looks like I built it on April 28, with a checkout made on April 6, last commit was in February, like you said.
15:02 khuckins__ joined #evergreen
15:03 Dyrcona Is Hatch need for offline mode in 2.12, or did miker's changes make it to 2.12, too?
15:03 Dyrcona Suppose I could search git or Launchpad, but asking here might be quicker. :)
15:03 berick i'm fairly certain Hatch is not required for offline mode
15:03 kmlussier No, hatch isn't used for offline.
15:04 Dyrcona OK. I'll check the 2.12 code just to corroborate. :)
15:04 kmlussier Dyrcona: Offline isn't in 2.12
15:04 * berick needs to remove some of the options from the Hatch UI
15:05 Dyrcona OK.
15:06 Dyrcona And, git confirms it.
15:06 Stompro joined #evergreen
15:06 * Dyrcona wanted to make a slashdot joke, about offline being dead, but it didn't seem to fit.
15:25 kmlussier Speaking of offline, I asked this question late Friday afternoon, which is a bad time to ask a question.
15:26 kmlussier All of my offline testing was done when my computer was offline or when I was in offline mode.
15:26 kmlussier I've noticed when rebuilding my VMs that offline doesn't seem to work if the Evergreen server is down.
15:27 kmlussier How will we be handling those situations where the Evergreen server is down?
15:35 Dyrcona I thought that was the point of offline, though granted you may have to make a connection first to get the required data.
15:36 kmlussier Dyrcona: Yes, you do have to make that connection first and load the patron edit screen.
15:38 Dyrcona So, you're saying that after that, it still doesn't work if the server is down?
15:39 * Dyrcona wonders why this seems familiar, like a case of deja vu.....
15:39 kmlussier Dyrcona: No, it doesn't. It only works if Internet is down on my end.
15:40 berick kmlussier: can you manually enter offline mode?
15:40 berick via the menu
15:41 kmlussier berick: No, when I go directly to the offline page, I get this: http://www.screencast.com/t/ghfvNo3w
15:41 berick it's beautiful!
15:41 kmlussier berick: Yeah, you can tell that to circ desk staff when they see it. :)
15:42 berick well i can't speak authoritatively on the subject, but it does seem like a LP bug is needed.
15:43 kmlussier berick: Actually, I get that display wherever I go in the staff client under those conditions. I think Chrome is only looking at the cached data if it's my computer that's without Internet.
15:43 kmlussier berick: OK, I can do that. I just wasn't sure if there was some step I was missing.
15:43 Dyrcona Yeah, when you were saying it only working when your Internet was down, I began to suspect it being browser behavior.
15:44 Dyrcona Probably some stupid assumption like: DNS works, so the site must work, too.
15:44 kmlussier Yeah, this is one of those things you wouldn't encounter when working offline in Google because how often does Google go down?
15:46 berick kmlussier: be sure to clarify exactly what is and is not running (EG, apache, websockets, etc.).  we may have a few different scenarios to address
15:46 berick sometimes I just get a 500 server error page depending on what's running.
15:48 miker kmlussier: that should not be true ... I suspect upup was not told about new required assets
15:49 kmlussier OK, I may need to nail down those bits more as far as what is and is not running.
15:50 kmlussier miker: In that case, wouldn't it not work when Internet is disconnected on my end?
15:50 miker going to the the offline interface should always work if you've logged in before, regardless of the status of the server or net connection
15:50 miker as in, going to the interface directly via, say, a bookmark, or the menu
15:51 berick yeah, was going to suggest..
15:51 berick kmlussier: what happens when you go to /eg/staff/offline-interface via the URL bar
15:51 berick well, https://hostname.blah/...
15:52 kmlussier berick: That's what I did before when I said I went directly to the offline page.
15:52 berick ah, missed that part of the comment
15:52 berick so it fails to render
15:53 kmlussier berick: yes
15:54 kmlussier miker: So have you gotten offline to work in your own testing where the Evergreen server is no longer available?
15:55 miker kmlussier: it's working for me right now on webby
15:55 miker (apache is off)
15:56 miker well, back on now
15:57 kmlussier miker: You're too quick for me. You turned it back on before I had a chance to try it. ;)
15:57 miker heh... well, go ahead and refresh by logging in and going to the patron reg page
15:57 miker then I'll turn it off for a minute
15:58 kmlussier miker: OK, I visited the patron reg page.
16:00 miker kmlussier: apache's down
16:00 miker hey webby, I'm in your interface offlinin' books ;)
16:02 kmlussier miker: hmmm, so it worked at first, but then after I cleared my browser cache (not app cache), I got the 503.
16:07 kmlussier On my own test server, if I simply stop Evergreen services, offline works.
16:08 miker ah, that's because of ngnix
16:09 miker or... wait...
16:10 miker haproxy on webby, rather
16:11 miker i18n.js
16:11 miker that's the missing required resource
16:11 miker and is super new
16:12 miker so, upup needs to learn about that
16:12 miker webby's back up now
16:15 kmlussier OK, so on my own server, I came across the screen not rendering after stopping apache and then clearing my browser cache. Offline worked fine when Evergreen services were down and when websockets weren't running.
16:16 miker kmlussier: right. because upup doesn't know about i18n.js ... that's the whole problem right there
16:17 kmlussier miker: OK, so I should file a bug?
16:17 miker sure, I'm making a branch
16:17 berick miker++
16:18 Dyrcona miker++
16:20 kmlussier bug 1721636
16:20 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1721636 in Evergreen "upup needs to learn about i18n.js" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1721636
16:20 kmlussier miker++
16:20 miker kmlussier: thanks
16:20 * miker makes a note at the top of base_js.tt2
16:29 miker kmlussier: http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=working​/Evergreen.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/​user/miker/lp-1721636-i18n_js-for-upup
16:29 miker kmlussier: you'll need to clear the service worker cache to test, obvs
16:31 * kmlussier prefers WARNING WARNING WARNING over ATTENTION ATTENTION ATTENTION because it reminds her of the Lost in Space robot.
16:31 miker kmlussier: ha! I started with WARNING, but changed it ... sorry :)
16:39 khuckins_ joined #evergreen
17:01 mmorgan left #evergreen
17:05 khuckins__ joined #evergreen
17:37 berick joined #evergreen
18:01 pinesol_green News from qatests: Test Success <http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live>
18:40 BobW__ joined #evergreen
19:47 yar joined #evergreen
22:09 wsmoak_ joined #evergreen
22:10 ejk_ joined #evergreen
22:10 eby_ joined #evergreen

| Channels | #evergreen index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary | Join Webchat