| Time |
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Message |
| 07:20 |
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| 09:16 |
* kmlussier |
wonders if it would be worthwhile to rename the Conference menu on the web site as Events and include other types of events there as well, such as the hack-a-way. It might also be a good place to link to the community calendar. |
| 09:18 |
collum |
kmlussier: I think that's a great idea. |
| 09:20 |
Dyrcona |
Yeah, sound good to me. |
| 09:24 |
kmlussier |
collum / Dyrcona: Thanks! |
| 09:24 |
* kmlussier |
will try to carve out some time to re-work that menu at some point. |
| 09:27 |
rhamby |
+1 to that idea as well |
| 09:39 |
* Dyrcona |
lives dangeroulsy....Messing with /etc/sudoers remotely. :) |
| 09:40 |
* gmcharlt |
casts a spell of No Typos on Dyrcona |
| 09:41 |
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| 09:53 |
Dyrcona |
heh. |
| 10:00 |
* tsbere |
has been known to mess with /etc/sudoers remotely....while in a sudo -i to root in a screen session so that he can test the changes and then fix them if he made a mistake ;) |
| 10:18 |
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| 10:21 |
Stompro |
Good morning! I'm trying to write some docs on copy notes and alerts. I'm curious if there is a reason that the alert field box in the item status/alternate view allows text input? There doesn't seem to be a way to save the alert text from there.. is there? |
| 10:23 |
kmlussier |
Stompro: I don't know why, but I'm not a big fan of the way those boxes display in the item status/alternate view for precisely that reason. It gives the impression that the fields are editable in the interface, but they aren't. |
| 10:25 |
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| 10:26 |
Stompro |
Thanks kmlussier, I'll file a bug on it if I cannot find one that is already created. It would be nice if it could be edited from there, there are too many oportunities to screw stuff up in the item attribute editor in my opinion. |
| 10:27 |
Stompro |
One other question for you... is there any way to tell that a copy has notes other than going into the item attribute editor, and selecting "Copy Notes"? |
| 10:28 |
kmlussier |
Alas, no. |
| 10:29 |
Stompro |
Thanks, just wanted to make sure. |
| 10:29 |
mmorgan |
That's one of the things that makes copy notes not as useful as they could be |
| 10:30 |
Stompro |
There must be a bug report on that one already. I think I've heard it talked about before. |
| 10:51 |
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| 10:59 |
Dyrcona |
So, from reading the documentation (http://docs.evergreen-ils.org/2.10/_authentication_proxy.html), it looks like Evergreen can communicate with multiple LDAP servers, and it can be used in concert with Evergreen's normal authentication. |
| 11:00 |
Dyrcona |
For those suing ldap, dbs ? dbwells ? is that so? |
| 11:00 |
Dyrcona |
heh. gmchartl's spell must have worn off. :) |
| 11:00 |
Dyrcona |
gah! |
| 11:01 |
Dyrcona |
gmcharlt's spell has definitely worn off. :) |
| 11:01 |
dbs |
Dyrcona: I believe so (different LDAP servers for different OUs), although we're only authing against one LDAP server. We used to use both LDAP (Laurentian) and CAS (Windsor) way back when. |
| 11:01 |
mmorgan |
Maybe gmcharlt made a typo when he cast the spell |
| 11:01 |
Dyrcona |
dbs: Thanks. That is what I gathered. |
| 11:01 |
gmcharlt |
mmorgan: all too likely, alas ;) |
| 11:01 |
dbs |
The only trick is that you need an Evergreen internal auth password to register a workstation because at the time of registration it doesn't know what OU to use for auth. |
| 11:02 |
dbs |
(maybe that could be changed with webby, dunno!) |
| 11:02 |
Dyrcona |
dbs: Duly noted. |
| 11:02 |
Dyrcona |
Well, the spell worked when I needed it. :) |
| 11:02 |
Dyrcona |
No typos in the sudoers file. |
| 11:07 |
Dyrcona |
dbs: LDAP covers the OPAC, too, right? |
| 11:08 |
Dyrcona |
I mean, I'm pretty sure it does, but just making sure. |
| 11:09 |
Dyrcona |
Oh, of course it does. That was my stupid question for the day. :) |
| 11:09 |
dbs |
hah, yeah :) |
| 11:09 |
dbs |
good to get it out of the way early! |
| 11:12 |
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| 11:16 |
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| 11:27 |
* kmlussier |
is quickly fading and decides to throw in the towel for the day. |
| 11:27 |
kmlussier |
Dyrcona: Best wishes on your first upgrade at C/W MARS. I hope everything goes well! |
| 11:27 |
dbs |
Dyrcona++ |
| 11:27 |
Dyrcona |
Thanks! |
| 11:28 |
Dyrcona |
I believe I am ready. |
| 11:31 |
Dyrcona |
Actually those sudoers changes I mentioned earlier were part of my preparations. |
| 11:32 |
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| 13:21 |
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| 13:43 |
bos20k |
Hello everyone. I have an Apache question. Does Evergreen require that we use the prefork MPM in Apache? Is there any reason why we couldn't use the event MPM? |
| 13:49 |
miker |
bos20k: event MPM is untested, but I would be very surprised if the opensrf libraries would work as expected in anything but prefork. they assume a connection per process to do what they want with. IOW, opensrf has a process-oriented architecture, and threads and multiplexing are not catered to |
| 13:51 |
bos20k |
miker: Hmmm. Ok, thanks. I have been watching our servers and it seems that more resources are taken up by Apache processes than anything else. Trying to think of ways to reduce that burden. |
| 13:53 |
miker |
that's where the resources are needed, and 2.4 seems much worse than 2.2, btw. just my $0.02 but unless you're hitting OOM errors, like dbs was recently, using them is what resources are for... :) |
| 13:54 |
miker |
are you, in fact, seeing errors? |
| 13:55 |
bos20k |
No, not errors. We see big spikes in traffic. Sometimes those spikes seem to slow things down enough that it makes the load balancers think one of the servers fell off a cliff. But there are no errors in the logs. |
| 13:56 |
* miker |
runs off to a meeting ... doh! |
| 14:27 |
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| 14:58 |
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Topic for #evergreen is now Welcome to the #evergreen library system channel! | We are publicly logged: http://irc.evergreen-ils.org/evergreen | Large pastes at http://paste.evergreen-ils.org |
| 15:13 |
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| 15:16 |
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| 15:16 |
dbs |
bos20k: I feel your pain |
| 15:17 |
bos20k |
dbs: Hehe. I am wondering if it would be better to have four smaller servers that we load balance across instead of two bigger ones. |
| 15:18 |
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| 15:19 |
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| 15:20 |
dbs |
we're still not entirely free of network timeouts with our one big server, alas |
| 15:20 |
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| 15:20 |
dbs |
but we've been OOM-free for 8 days, so that's a bonus. |
| 15:21 |
bos20k |
dbs: sorry if I missed anything. I was on an IRC server that got rebooted. |
| 15:21 |
dbs |
PostgreSQL has a dedicated server, of course. I'm just talking about one big opensrf / app / apache server. |
| 15:21 |
dbs |
not much, just 15:20 < dbs> we're still not entirely free of network timeouts with our one big server, alas |
| 15:24 |
bos20k |
Hmmm. We have two VMs as our head end app servers. Each has 24 cores and 32GB allocated to it. Apache doesn't keep up sometimes. That's why I'm looking at options. miker says Apache event MPM is unlikely to work. So, I have been fiddling with the prefork MPM settings a bit today. I kind of doubt it will make much difference but we'll see. |
| 15:25 |
bos20k |
If I can't seem to make any headway I was thinking for the future maybe I will split these two up in to 4 VMs with 8-12 cores each instead of 2 with 24 cores each. |
| 15:26 |
Dyrcona |
bos20k: I've been there and have no real solution other than tweak your settings until you find something that mostly works. |
| 15:26 |
bshum |
bos20k: Ages past, we used to track that sort of memory utilization with stuff like munin and it didn't used to spike much beyond 12-14 GB; but also we weren't running apache 2.4 back in those days. |
| 15:26 |
Dyrcona |
Yeap. It's definitely worse on 2.4. Something changed with memory management, I'm sure. |
| 15:27 |
bos20k |
bshum: the memory utilization seems to stay in that 12-14GB range on each VM. |
| 15:27 |
Dyrcona |
bos20k: I've seen individual apache processes using up to 1GB of RAM. |
| 15:27 |
* dbs |
did revise the "MaxConnectionsPerChild" way down in http://docs.evergreen-ils.org/2.11/_configure_the_apache_web_server.html |
| 15:27 |
bos20k |
It just seems that Apache doesn't keep up with the spikes in traffic then the load balancers will take one of them out occasionally for no other obvious reason. |
| 15:28 |
bshum |
It's not cause ldirector is looking for that crazy ping file and can't cause too many jobs doing other things, right? |
| 15:28 |
dbs |
Keeping KeepAliveTimeout at 1, MaxKeepAliveRequests 100, and MaxConnectionsPerChild 500 at least took care of the worst of the memory leakage. |
| 15:29 |
dbs |
but as Dyrcona says, every env will be different :/ |
| 15:29 |
Dyrcona |
yeah, but lower maxconnectionsperchild definitely helps. |
| 15:29 |
Dyrcona |
They don't stick around long enough to eat 1GB of RAM. |
| 15:30 |
dbs |
at some point csharp had pointed at max simultaneous connections in memcached as a bottleneck they had faced, but that was a very different environment |
| 15:30 |
dbs |
oh yeah, and enabling SMP mode in ejabberd made a big difference for us too. |
| 15:30 |
dbs |
tsbere++ # for his old blog post on that, IIRC |
| 15:30 |
Dyrcona |
yeah. |
| 15:31 |
bos20k |
bshum: that is my assumption given the fact that I am not seeing anything obvious in the logs. My asumtpion based on watching what happens is traffic spikes are occasionally not handled by Apache even though there should be sufficient resources in the VM then the load balancers will take out one of the VMs for a number of seconds until the spike subsides enough then puts it back in. |
| 15:31 |
tsbere |
dbs: I still find that useful myself :D |
| 15:33 |
Dyrcona |
At C/W MARS we're still using apache 2.2 and I don't see this issue here. |
| 15:33 |
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| 15:35 |
bshum |
bos20k: If you do rearchitect the VMs, I always like to prop up this suggestion I heard to split access between staff and public users. Like have one URL and couple backends for public and then use a separate URL and backends for staff. |
| 15:35 |
bshum |
Dyrcona++ # for good ideas that I wish I'd had time to do |
| 15:35 |
Dyrcona |
tsbere++ # It was really his idea. |
| 15:35 |
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| 15:35 |
bshum |
Though, Dyrcona wasn't there the whole book on the enter key weirdness that we still haven't pinned down? |
| 15:36 |
Dyrcona |
Well, there's no good solution for that for Apache, anyway. It's not just an Evergreen problem. |
| 15:37 |
bshum |
Indeed. |
| 15:37 |
bshum |
I guess if we ran out of children to get the ldirectorping file, it'd drop it from rotation. That sucks :\ |
| 15:37 |
tsbere |
bshum: It also helps when your staff and public use different domains, so have different certificates, and thus needed different IPs in the first place... |
| 15:37 |
Dyrcona |
Some kind of traffic shaping rules on a firewall could do it. |
| 15:39 |
* bshum |
remembers the time he used some command that he stole from hopkinsju to request 10k home pages of Evergreen and "accidentally" killed someone's system |
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dbs |
bshum: probably a command starting with "ab " :) |
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