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IRC log for #evergreen, 2014-10-06

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Time Nick Message
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03:42 vanya I made some changes in the code while fixing a bug. Then I ran make and make install again to see if the modified code works. However, my apache crashed due to that. Can anyone tell me where I'm going wrong?
05:53 pinesol_green Incoming from qatests: Test Success - http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live/test.html <http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live/test.html>
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08:33 eeevil @later bshum I think lp 1374091 still hurts in master...
08:33 pinesol_green eeevil: You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
08:34 eeevil @later tell bshum I think lp 1374091 still hurts in master...
08:34 pinesol_green eeevil: The operation succeeded.
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09:22 bshum eeevil: Yes, but there's not much point in leaving a bug open against master for tracking in LP usually. I prefer to keep it towards actual milestones.
09:23 bshum Nobody really uses series targeting for meaningful reasons, but I getcha.
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09:24 bshum For bug fixes, I don't get the point of leaving them open against 2.next or whatever for months.
09:26 bshum And that usually ends up being what master series targets.
09:26 bshum Unless you actually use the master LP for lookups though... To see what is targeted to master. In which case we could do that from now on.
09:27 bshum For me, I just assume the first line that says it's a bug on Evergreen to mean master is broken.
09:28 bshum Any subsequent series target to focus on a specific branch and milestone for tracking fixes across series.
09:30 eeevil bshum: fair enough. I have, in the past, explicitly targetted master because there are bugs that are not in master but are in back branches
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09:30 eeevil though I can't claim that I have always been 100% consistent in that regard
09:31 bshum Consistent doesn't apply to LP. It's just an ever evolving *thing*
09:31 eeevil :)
09:31 bshum But whatever works.
09:31 bshum :D
09:37 bshum The important thing I need to do is get that signed and back ported
09:37 bshum Maybe later today.
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10:34 vanya Hello everyone. After I make changes in the code, I wanted to test it out.
10:35 vanya I had downloaded the staff client and the server from the link given.
10:37 vanya When I make the server again , the changes are not reflected on the client. I was wondering if someone could tell me how to build the client according to my changes.
10:39 tsbere vanya: You may need to re-install the client if you aren't using automatic updates
10:39 tsbere (especially if it is client-side code you are changing)
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10:47 vanya tsbere : Thank you. The staff client given in Evergreen/Open-ILS/xul/chrome
10:47 vanya Or the one downloaded from the link in doc?
10:54 tsbere vanya: you can build your own installer. You will need zip/unzip and nsis.
10:56 kmlussier vanya: This might help - http://evergreen-ils.org/dokuwiki/doku.php?​id=mozilla-devel:building_the_staff_client
10:57 vanya Thank you :)
10:57 vanya I'll try it out.
10:59 tsbere kmlussier: Heh, I was looking for that, then got distracted
11:18 mmorgan Can someone confirm that the CIRC_OVERRIDE_DUE_DATE permission CANNOT be configured to prevent editing due dates on items owned by other org units?
11:27 tsbere mmorgan: As I believe it is based on the library the circ is happening at, and not the item in any way, shape, or form, I think I can confirm that.
11:30 mmorgan that's what my testing has shown. I was hoping that the depth of the permission might pertain to ownership, but that does not appear to be the case.
11:32 tsbere mmorgan: Note that preventing the due date from being overridden would help with "you can't make it due later" but who is going to complain about someone trying to get an item to come back *sooner*? :P
11:33 tsbere (outside of the person checking the item out, anyway)
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12:31 kmlussier I was just looking at the Load patron from Checkout OU setting. It has the following description: "When scanning barcodes into Checkout auto-detect if a new patron barcode is scanned and auto-load the new patron."
12:32 kmlussier I've set it to true, but nothing new happens when I scan unknown barcodes at checkout. Does it work with another setting?
12:39 tsbere kmlussier: Are you scanning patron barcodes into checkout? Also, you may have to log out and back in again to get it to apply.
12:40 kmlussier tsbere: Yes, patron barcodes. And I logged out and back in. Does it have to work along with auto-completing barcode settings? I don't have any of those set.
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12:42 tsbere kmlussier: Hmmm. Some of that was implemented with the auto-complete code, and I seem to recall someone saying "lets not auto-complete if there are no auto-complete definitions" - In checkout that could mean "can't autodetect patron barcodes even if set"
12:43 kmlussier Hmmm...let me check with an auto-complete setting.
12:45 kmlussier Nope. I'm getting nothing here.
12:46 tsbere kmlussier: Did you log out and back in after adding an active auto-complete setting?
12:47 jeff does that feature use opac.barcode_regex to identify "this is a patron barcode"?
12:47 kmlussier I actually switched to a server that already had active auto-complete settings. :)
12:47 tsbere jeff: no
12:52 kmlussier Ah, well. I was just checking it to see if it worked as well in the web client as it does in xul. But since I can't get it to work in xul, I'll move on. :)
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14:33 Stompro kmlussier: were you talking about the barcode completion feature.. auto-complete?  The places where that is enabled are; Find patron by barcode, OPAC's staff client place hold, Checkout, checkin, item status.  It doesn't work in the find patron by name form when you fill in the barcode field.
14:34 jeff Stompro: slightly different but related feature -- the "auto-load patron if patron barcode is scanned where we would expect an item barcode in the checkout interface"
14:35 jeff Stompro++
14:37 Stompro Jeff: Thanks, interesting feature.
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14:51 kmlussier Wow! No new agenda items today?
14:52 berick i think dbwells_ will like http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku​.php?id=opw:ui_suggest#julia_lima
14:52 berick julialima++
14:52 berick kmlussier: going to be a short meeting ;)
14:52 bshum I was going to say, the graphic is awesome :)
14:53 * kmlussier never posted minutes in the right place for the July meeting. :(
14:53 * bshum somehow envisioned it like old Batman show
14:53 bshum Action!
14:53 bshum Effect!
14:53 bshum Feedback!
14:53 bshum :D
14:53 berick bshum: totally
14:53 kmlussier berick: I found some old action items to add. Give me a second and I'll add them.
14:53 bshum But more seriously, it is a very nicely outlined description.
14:55 kmlussier Done
14:56 kmlussier julialima++
14:56 bshum I'm getting rid of the 2014-10-07 page
14:56 bshum Since that's the wrong agenda :)
14:56 bshum And I was looking at the wrong one
14:56 berick anyone want to volunteer to run the meeting?
14:57 jeff sure.
14:57 berick bshum: thanks.. forgot i created that
14:57 berick jeff++
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14:58 kmlussier jeff++
14:58 kmlussier berick++ #scheduling the meeting. :)
14:59 dbwells berick: julialima: looks good :)
14:59 * kmlussier adds an agenda item for wrap-up of bug squashing day.
15:00 jeff #startmeeting 2014-10-06 - Developer Meeting
15:00 pinesol_green Meeting started Mon Oct  6 15:00:56 2014 US/Eastern.  The chair is jeff. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
15:00 pinesol_green Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
15:00 pinesol_green The meeting name has been set to '2014_10_06___developer_meeting'
15:00 jeff #link http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/dok​u.php?id=dev:meetings:2014-10-06 meeting agenda here
15:01 jeff #topic Introductions
15:01 jeff #info jeff is Jeff Godin, Traverse Area District Library (TADL)
15:01 bshum #info bshum is Ben Shum, Bibliomation
15:01 phasefx #info phasefx is Jason Etheridge, Equinox Software
15:01 tsbere #info tsbere is Thomas Berezansky, MVLC
15:01 kmlussier #info kmlussier is Kathy Lussier, MassLNC
15:01 dbwells #info dbwells = Dan Wells, Hekman Library (Calvin College)
15:01 remingtron #info remingtron is Remington Steed, Hekman Library (Calvin College)
15:02 berick #info berick Bill Erickson KCLS
15:02 kmlussier OPW candidates should feel free to introduce themselves here too. :)
15:02 kmlussier And welcome!
15:03 jeff Yes, welcome!
15:03 Dyrcona #info Jason Stephenson, MVLC
15:03 jeff #topic Action items from last meeting
15:03 jeff #info kmlussier and others to make time to test the latest branch (negative balances).
15:03 jeff kmlussier: anything to report?
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15:04 kmlussier Yes, I've done more testing and reported my most recent feedback to the bug.
15:04 kmlussier I thought I saw a new branch floating around during the hack-a-way. Is that something that's ready for testing?
15:04 jeff excellent. related:
15:04 jeff #info dbwells to work on display ideas for negative balance branch
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15:05 dbwells It's blossomed into a few different branches.
15:05 jeff (this may answer kmlussier's question, if not -- feel free to chime in regardless of the current bullet item)
15:06 jeff dbwells: testing and eyeballs being needed, as always?
15:06 dbwells The extra fine bug was actually related to a separate code branch for "new overdues for returned lost" stuff
15:06 DPearl #info DPearl = Dan Pearl, C/W MARS
15:06 dbwells That is it's own branch, courtesy of berick and eeevil
15:06 dbwells Then we have the current negative balances bug branch.
15:07 kmlussier Ah! It may explain an issue we came across when working on another billing project. Has that 'new overdues' branch been posted to LP?
15:07 jeff #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1198465 Support for Conditional Negative Balances
15:07 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1198465 in Evergreen "Support for Conditional Negative Balances" (affected: 14, heat: 62) [Wishlist,Confirmed]
15:07 dbwells Then we have a separate branch written mostly at the Hack-a-Way for display, which is (at this point) independant of the neg balances branch.
15:07 dbwells My plan is to create new bugs for the two new branches, and then update the original bug with all this info.
15:08 dbwells Put me down as an action item to do just that.
15:08 jeff dbwells++ thanks
15:08 berick dbwells++
15:08 kmlussier I'll test anything dbwells puts out there. :)
15:08 bshum dbwells++
15:08 kmlussier dbwells++
15:08 bshum kmlussier++ # testing too :)
15:08 jeff #action dbwells to update Conditional Negative Balances bug 1198465 with links to new branches, etc.
15:08 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1198465 in Evergreen "Support for Conditional Negative Balances" (affected: 14, heat: 62) [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1198465
15:09 jeff kmlussier++ dbwells++ berick++ Dyrcona++ and probably more :-)
15:09 jeff #info jeff and csharp to test websockets work by the end of this week.
15:09 jeff That happened and/or didn't happen, but what did happen was (iirc):
15:09 jeff #info gmcharlt to cut alpha of OpenSRF the middle of next week (week of Aug. 4th)
15:10 bshum That did occur I think
15:10 bshum Or at least, there's an OpenSRF 2.4 alpha around :)
15:10 * jeff nods
15:10 jeff #info kmlussier to move Sandbox discussion to dev list
15:10 bshum And the websockets stuff I think I poked at a bit.
15:11 jeff i believe that also happened in advance of the bug squashing day
15:11 kmlussier Done.
15:11 jeff #info berick to add an LP bug for web based circ client with notes on pre-reqs and a list of existing client interfaces that need special attention.
15:11 jeff And that happened!
15:11 bshum yes
15:12 jeff #topic Development Updates
15:12 jeff #topic Release info - OpenSRF
15:13 dbs #info dbs is Dan Scott, Laurentian University (3 hours of meetings and counting)
15:13 jeff I'm not sure if gmcharlt is present, but we do have a new OpenSRF alpha out since last meeting.
15:14 bshum Last I talked with gmcharlt in channel, he mentioned getting OpenSRF 2.4 out soon.
15:15 bshum There's a few things we have to put in there I think
15:15 bshum And I need to revisit the updates I made to the main README for websocket steps.
15:15 jeff bshum: currently, due to websockets and other things, Evergreen 2.7 does require OpenSRF 2.4 alpha, correct? Downloads page seems to confirm...
15:15 bshum Generally speaking, yes.
15:15 bshum I never tested it with anything less.
15:15 bshum I think that's correct though.
15:16 bshum It doesn't require websockets
15:16 jeff bshum: anything specific that you/gmcharlt could use help/signoff with toward the goal of OpenSRF 2.4 making it to release?
15:16 bshum But I think there were other changes.
15:16 bshum Bug with branch is https://bugs.launchpad.net/opensrf/+bug/1369169
15:16 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1369169 in OpenSRF "Add install instructions for websockets to README (and other cleanup)" (affected: 1, heat: 6) [Undecided,New]
15:17 bshum For the README stuff
15:17 jeff since bshum says gmcharlt already has intention of this being an action item, i don't feel too bad giving him an action item in his absence.
15:17 jeff #action gmcharlt to release OpenSRF 2.4 when ready
15:17 Dyrcona bshum is the expert but I don't recall anything critical to 2.7 in 2.4.
15:17 jeff #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/opensrf/+bug/1369169 OpenSRF README updates to be considered for 2.4 release
15:18 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1369169 in OpenSRF "Add install instructions for websockets to README (and other cleanup)" (affected: 1, heat: 6) [Undecided,New]
15:18 bshum Now that Dyrcona mentions it, the only reason to use OpenSRF 2.4 with Evergreen 2.7 is if you wanted websockets to play with the web based staff client.  I think.
15:18 ldw #info ldw is Liam Whalen Sitka
15:18 jeff #topic Release info - Evergreen
15:18 bshum I didn't personally test OpenSRF 2.3 stable with Evergreen 2.7 though to make sure that XUL stuff and catalog is still happy.
15:18 jeff Evergreen 2.7 is released! Everyone's upgraded by now, right?
15:18 * jeff ducks
15:18 bshum If anyone wants to volunteer to try that, maybe that's worth it.
15:18 bshum But really, getting 2.4 out the door is better anyways :D
15:19 bshum jeff: Actually......!
15:19 jeff #info Testing of Evergreen 2.7 with OpenSRF 2.3 would be appreciated -- pass feedback to bshum
15:19 Dyrcona jeff: We're on 2.7alpha give or take a few later fixes.
15:19 bshum We were going to upgrade to 2.7 a few days after I cut 2.7.0, but we were delayed a bit.  We plan our upgrade to 2.7 this upcoming Saturday.
15:19 jeff excellent.
15:19 bshum The maintenance release schedule calls for new cuts next week 10/15 I think?
15:19 * bshum checks the calendar
15:20 bshum Yes, Wednesday 10/15
15:20 bshum I expect to push things into master and rel_2_7, etc. to prepare for that
15:20 bshum The big thing i want to see there is the updated i18n script so that we can pull more recent translations for tpac and other areas into the next 2.7 release.
15:20 bshum 2.7.1 should be better.
15:21 jeff #info bshum to push things to rel_2_7 in preparation for scheduled 2.7.1 maintenance release
15:21 bshum If anyone else has any bug fixes with code that they want to see in 2.7.1, please feel free to target or put a pullrequest up.
15:21 jeff #info bshum pulling updated translations for tpac (and other areas) into 2.7.1
15:22 bshum And if anyone has time to test and sign-off on them, that'd be great too :)
15:22 jeff bshum: anything else for Evergreen release info/updates?
15:22 bshum Nothing for me.  I hope to keep 2.7 series happy and stable.
15:22 jeff #info targeting, testing/signoff of bugs against 2.7.1 appreciated as always
15:22 jeff bshum++
15:23 kmlussier bshum++
15:23 Dyrcona bshum++
15:23 jeff #topic New Business
15:23 jeff #topic Bug Squashing Day Wrap-Up
15:23 jeff kmlussier: want to take this one?
15:23 kmlussier Sure
15:23 jeff #link http://evergreen-ils.org/b​ug-squashing-day-wrap-up/ bug squashing day wrapup
15:24 kmlussier The August bug squashing day was somewhat of a trial balloon to see if it helped move bugs along and get new people involved in the bug squashing effort.
15:24 kmlussier I was just looking for some informal feedback to see if you all think it's worth pursuing on a regular basis. Quarterly is what I originally recommended.
15:25 bshum More like a pinata we busted open with lots of tasty candy in the form of bug signoffs and fixes pushed, in my opinion.
15:25 kmlussier Also, if you think anything could be done to improve bug squashing days or to make it easier for more people to participate, let me know.
15:25 kmlussier :D
15:25 jeff For those who set up or used the sandboxes, how did that go?
15:25 bshum I loved seeing all the contributions everybody made on the first bug squashing day.
15:26 Bmagic I had no problem with it. I think it was a good thing! (setting up sandboxes and applying patches)
15:26 kmlussier tsbere created a script that makes it very easy to set up the MassLNC bug squashing sandboxes.
15:26 dbs pinatas++
15:26 ldw I found working with the sandbox very easy and enjoyable.
15:26 dbs pinatas-filled-with-bugs--
15:26 jeff Bmagic++ tsbere++
15:27 berick I was unable to attend the first one.  hope we can do it again.
15:27 kmlussier Also, the MassLNC sandboxes continue to be available between bug squashing days. I need to highlight them better on the community web site.
15:27 bshum We talked about quarterly right?
15:27 bshum If they were a good thing, that is.
15:27 jeff MassLNC++
15:27 kmlussier bshum: Yes, I think quarterly would work well.
15:28 Bmagic quarterly is ok with me
15:28 kmlussier Meaning our next day would need to be November? Is that right?
15:28 jeff i wasn't able to participate either, but it sounds like the first one was successful. who wants to take the action item of scheduling a second one?
15:28 kmlussier I can do that.
15:28 jeff kmlussier++ out of one scheduling task and into another
15:29 jeff #action kmlussier to schedule another Bug Squashing Day
15:29 kmlussier Heh
15:29 kmlussier I'll try to do it soon so that people have plenty of lead time to set the day aside in their calendars.
15:30 bshum kmlussier++
15:30 jeff anything else on the topic of bug squashing?
15:31 jeff #topic Feedback for New Features Under Development
15:32 kmlussier I don't think we have any new features up for discussion this time around.
15:32 jeff Is anyone currently working on new features that they'd like to bring up for discussion or for general "hey, go look at this and provide feedback" purposes?
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15:33 * bshum listens for the crickets...
15:33 ldw I just made a feature for Import MARC records, that allows items from on-order records to be matched with items from the records being imported.
15:34 bshum ldw: is that different from vandelay matching on copy id?
15:34 kmlussier What do they match on?
15:34 ldw It also does org-unit matching, so it overlays the incoming record on top of the record with the most copies from the org unit.
15:34 bshum I mean yes, what fields.
15:34 jeff ldw: sounds nice! local code only at this point, or do you have a working branch with intent to submit for inclusion in Evergreen?
15:34 ldw It uses the current match logic, but matches on copy-status as well looking for 'on-order'
15:34 jeff ldw++ sitka++
15:35 kmlussier Ooh! That could be handy.
15:35 ldw jeff: It is local code only.
15:35 kmlussier ldw++
15:35 ldw I can move it over though.
15:35 dbwells ldw: That sounds a lot like the "opportunistic" overlay added in 2.6 (2.5?)
15:35 dbwells 2.5
15:36 ldw dbwells: yes, it was heavily bassed on that. But, it works outside of Acq.
15:36 jeff ldw: even if it's not yet ready for pullrequest, please do share. you may find that someone else with sufficient motivation/tuits can do integration and you don't have to. :-)
15:36 * csharp suddenly remembers this meeting
15:36 dbwells ldw: Ah, thanks
15:36 * kmlussier waves to csharp
15:36 ldw jeff: Ok, I will post to the list with the branch on Sitka's git.
15:37 bshum ldw++
15:38 jeff There's also some interesting possible development of features going on related to OPW, which gives me a chance to bring up:
15:38 jeff #topic Evergreen participation in OPW - Outreach Program for Women
15:38 jeff kmlussier++ for running with this one -- i can't remember if i should be incrementing someone else equally, i know there have been many hands involved.
15:39 kmlussier opw-mentors++
15:39 kmlussier We've had a fair number of candidates asking questions here and on the list. And also posting some ideas for feedback.
15:39 kmlussier Are any here right now and watching the meeting?
15:40 jeff #link http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?id=opw Project Ideas for Outreach Program for Women
15:41 kmlussier The application deadline is coming up in a couple of weeks. As people come in and ask questions, I encourage everyone to help out when and if they can.
15:41 jeff #link https://wiki.gnome.org/OutreachProgramForWomen
15:41 kmlussier From what I've seen so far, everyone has been very helpful.
15:41 csharp a few are popping in on the weekend, I noticed
15:42 csharp might be worth a weekend check-in from time to time
15:42 dbs Yep, kmlussier's idea of advertising IRC office hours for mentors makes sense
15:42 jeff kmlussier: are there other project ideas like http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku​.php?id=opw:ui_suggest#julia_lima that have been created in the wiki that you know of? Are ideas like that linked from somewhere else in the wiki that I didn't see?
15:42 * dbs splits
15:42 bshum i think that's the first one in the wiki that I've seen so far.
15:42 kmlussier That's the only one I know of so far. It's the recommended contribution for the UI project.
15:43 jeff dbs++ say hi to your next meeting!
15:43 kmlussier I know I've received a request from one other candidate for the project to set up a wiki account. berick may know more since he is a mentor for that project.
15:43 csharp looks like the biggest hurdles they're facing are installation and what to restart to see code changes - dunno if there's any docs on that anywhere
15:43 jeff kmlussier: anything else to add or any action items you have in mind?
15:43 kmlussier We've had several bitesize doc contributions from one candidate too.
15:44 kmlussier dbs mentioned the office hours, so I'll elaborate on that a bit.
15:44 csharp ~hours
15:44 jeff csharp: might be a good place to start dev-focused chapters in the docs :-)
15:44 jeff csharp++
15:44 csharp yeap
15:44 kmlussier When we have selected interns for the projects, we agreed that the mentors should set up weekly office hours in IRC to discuss the projects.
15:45 kmlussier That way, the projects are being discussed in the open and we can keep up to date on how the project is going. We'll be adding those office hours to the calendar when the time comes.
15:45 csharp ~hours is <reply> Most #evergreen participants are active during the hours of 9:00 AM and 5:00 PM Eastern Time, Monday through Friday.
15:45 pinesol_green I'll remember that, csharp
15:45 kmlussier But maybe we should do some ahead of time for the candidates. Especially if they're dropping in on the weekends?
15:47 jeff If people are able to commit to that, great -- otherwise I'd suggest just being aware that new faces coming in looking for assistance with install/setup/etc are likely OPW participants, and to... well, pretty much do what you normally would do, right? Assist in any way that you can, as time permits, etc. :-)
15:47 kmlussier jeff: I don't have any action items at this time.
15:47 jeff kmlussier: got it. thanks!
15:47 jeff #topic Evergreen 2.8 Release Manager
15:48 jeff added to the agenda at the request of bshum, it's time to start thinking about the Evergreen 2.8 Release Manager
15:48 bshum Thanks jeff
15:48 bshum So I briefly mentioned this in a quick post on the dev list the other day
15:48 jeff I don't recall if traditionally we've burdened the current RM with some of the tasks of kicking off the selection process for the next RM.
15:48 bshum We discussed at the Hack-A-Way that we're going to ask the immediately preceding RM to ask for volunteers for next.
15:49 bshum So yeah, traditionally, but it's semi-official.
15:49 bshum :)
15:49 csharp #info see https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lL9S07​c8X_zfXSexXfnwzRllnvVvJsW0qf65QxGtH7A/edit - "2.next" discussion
15:49 jeff clear responsibility there. :-)
15:49 jeff csharp++
15:49 kmlussier Is there anyone who has shown interest yet?
15:50 bshum #link http://markmail.org/message/5cba3zdvshegq2fx
15:50 jeff also, mosh++ -- without which i would not be able to be here today. oof.
15:50 csharp heh
15:51 bshum So, yeah, don't step up all at once :)
15:51 bshum You can think about it a bit.
15:51 jeff bshum: anything else you want to cover today regarding 2.8 RM?
15:51 kmlussier I'm assuming RM needs to be a core committer, right?
15:52 bshum kmlussier: That's something we haven't codified per say.  But I think that whoever is elected to RM would need to be trusted by the community to shepard Evergreen's next steps.
15:53 bshum Speaking as a former release manager (I say former, because I have actually released something), I find that the job entails more about keeping to timelines.
15:54 bshum The technical portion of reviewing code and making decisions still rests with the whole core committers and other contributors to the developer team.
15:54 bshum And I would have been lost without much of the input I received from many of you all.
15:54 bshum :D
15:54 jeff bshum++
15:55 jeff #topic 2014 Hack-a-way Summary
15:55 berick a non-core-commiter RM would just need a trusty committer on retainer
15:55 jeff #link https://docs.google.com/a/tadl.org/document/d/1l​L9S07c8X_zfXSexXfnwzRllnvVvJsW0qf65QxGtH7A/edit 2014 Hackaway Collaboration document
15:55 berick for pushing release branches.  certainly doabl, though
15:55 jeff berick: yeah, logistically-speaking, tricky but possible.
15:56 * bshum starts staring at kmlussier intently.
15:56 kmlussier Why is bshum staring at me?
15:56 bshum Oops, that wasn't supposed to be in the main channel :)
15:56 jeff Anyone from the hackaway want to summarize/wrap up, or just point at a blog post or other document instead?
15:56 berick bshum: kmlussier: hahaaa
15:57 bshum jeff: I think Rogan wrote up a nice write-up on his blog
15:57 * bshum digs around
15:57 bshum http://www.roganhamby.com/evergreen/2014​/9/27/hack-a-way-2014-wrapup-and-photos
15:57 dbwells I think being an RM who couldn't commit to master would be a pretty major hassle.  My two cents.
15:58 jeff #link http://www.roganhamby.com/evergreen/2014​/9/27/hack-a-way-2014-wrapup-and-photos 2014 Hack-a-way wrap-up from Rogan
15:58 bshum But yeah, the google doc is a loose thing of all the stuff we were working on
15:59 csharp I understand that we don't have a slew of core committers, but that seems to me like a necessary hurdle for an RM
15:59 csharp (as one who was put forward informally as a future RM at the Hackaway ;-))
16:00 kmlussier That was my assumption too, but it probably should be written down somewhere. :)
16:00 Dyrcona Well, someone could alway be granted the necessary access.
16:00 bshum Dyrcona++
16:00 bshum :)
16:01 jeff this is probably a good discussion to continue outside of the meeting, either immediately following or at another time. :-)
16:01 csharp yeah
16:01 jeff Anyone else have agenda items before I endmeeting?
16:02 jeff #endmeeting
16:02 pinesol_green Meeting ended Mon Oct  6 16:02:00 2014 US/Eastern.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
16:02 pinesol_green Minutes:        http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2014/evergreen.2014-10-06-15.00.html
16:02 pinesol_green Minutes (text): http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2014/evergreen.2014-10-06-15.00.txt
16:02 pinesol_green Log:            http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergree​n/2014/evergreen.2014-10-06-15.00.log.html
16:02 bshum jeff++ # meeting wrangling
16:02 csharp jeff++
16:02 kmlussier jeff++
16:02 berick jeff++
16:02 Dyrcona jeff++
16:02 csharp OUR NEW OVERLORD
16:02 Dyrcona heh
16:02 dbwells jeff++
16:02 bshum Maybe it's just too much pressure
16:02 bshum Being the RM
16:02 bshum Nobody seems to want it very long (or at all)
16:03 csharp re: core committer access - I would want to know what the "path" toward that access is/should be
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16:03 kmlussier At one time, didn't there used to be a "release team"? Would it help with the pressure if there were more people involved in various aspects of the release?
16:04 csharp I understand it has been an informal process in the past, but I would want to know that our core committers have achieved some sort of standing in the development community through their code contributions
16:04 Dyrcona csharp: There isn't an official path, but typically, the current core committers have voted at the conference.
16:05 csharp the RM can be more of a project manager, though, as bshum and I were discussing at the Hackaway - PMs don't necessarily need to be subject matter experts
16:05 bshum Or at a hackaway
16:05 bshum Basically when there's enough quorum to vote
16:05 csharp but the logistics of pushing commits to master appears to be a basic task in the RM job desc
16:06 Dyrcona yeah, and I'd think being rm would be 1 way to become a core committer rather easily.
16:06 Dyrcona or quickly...
16:07 csharp this is a super-busy season for PINES as we gear up for the next upgrade, so I'm pretty much out for this go round
16:07 csharp if I continue doing bugfixes, etc. in the meantime, I may "earn" core committer rights by the next upgrade cycle - dunno ;-)
16:08 Dyrcona ;)
16:08 dbwells csharp: The path has generally involved demonstrated competence at writing Evergreen code and working with other members of the community.  I wouldn't want to change that.  I'd rather reframe what the RM does (berick's "trusty committer on retainer" model) than grant commit access just to widen the RM pool.
16:09 Dyrcona As was mentioned in the meeting, I could see it working without commit status, but it would be more difficult.
16:10 * gmcharlt jumps in to agree with Dyrcona and dbwells
16:10 gmcharlt of course, one want to split the difference would be a co-RM model
16:10 Dyrcona yeah, the branch could always be built in the working repo.
16:10 gmcharlt i.e., a non-committer RM as project manager and driver, with a committer who (well) commits time to push stuff to master in consulation with the RM
16:10 * Dyrcona thought of co-rm during the meeting but didn't type anything....to many irons in the fire right now.
16:11 jeff without committing (heh) to any one approach, i'd say it might be worth noting that people interested in being RM should not exclude themselves from consideration if they are not a core committer, and that if voted in as RM, logistics (trusty committer on retainer, temporary commit access, automatic core committer) could be determined at that time.
16:11 csharp dbwells: I agree with you
16:11 dbwells gmcharlt: right on.
16:12 jeff (and i'm not advocating any of the three options i listed yet)
16:12 csharp flexibility++
16:13 gmcharlt for myself - I expect to rather more cycles to dev and push stuff over the next six months; I do not have the cycles to be an effective RM, co- or otherwise, this round
16:13 csharp the co-RM idea would be a good way to mentor too
16:13 jeff but "I was interested in taking on the role of Release Manager, but I don't have a commit bit" potentially be a loss.
16:13 jeff i a few words there. :P
16:13 csharp mosh letting you down?
16:13 bshum csharp: I thought about maybe getting some RM-in-training thing, where we try making the release manager responsibilities and process a bit less opaque.
16:13 csharp :-P
16:14 bshum Like getting the scratchnotes that have been handed from RM to RM written up somewhere nicer for others to follow/practice with.
16:18 jeff "To my successor: Evergreen releases are actually coordinated by a very small shell script which became self-aware in early 2011. The world is not yet ready for this secret, but all will be revealed in due time."
16:18 bshum I knew there was sorcery involved...
16:18 bshum :)
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16:32 bshum sylvar++
16:32 bshum Remembering this great illustration of evils of scrollbars:  https://launchpadlibrarian.net/91130446​/yo-dawg-i-heard-you-like-scrolling.png
16:35 gmcharlt re bug 1254918, a backport branch for 2.6 exists, and I've targeted this for 2.6.4
16:35 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1254918 in Evergreen 2.6 "rendering the fund drop-down in the line batch update controls can be slow" (affected: 6, heat: 30) [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1254918
16:35 gmcharlt if folks have any objection to the backport, please speak up
16:37 bshum No objection from me.
16:37 * bshum defers to dbwells though.
16:43 dbwells gmcharlt: Sounds like it's been in production for months already, so no objections from me.
16:44 gmcharlt k, I shall push it
16:44 gmcharlt thanks for the feedback!
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17:35 pinesol_green Incoming from qatests: Test Success - http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live/test.html <http://testing.evergreen-ils.org/~live/test.html>
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