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IRC log for #evergreen, 2013-10-17

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All times shown according to the server's local time.

Time Nick Message
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08:49 csharp berick: is there a 2.3.11 git branch planned?  I manage our customizations in git and it's way easier to just merge branches, but I'm looking towards a 2.3 point release upgrade to which I will add gmcharlt's memory leak fixes
08:50 csharp or if you were waiting for tests of the tarball, I can do that too
08:50 berick csharp: an oversight.  it's sitting in a working branchh..  I'll push it now.
08:52 csharp excellent - thanks!
08:53 berick csharp: pushed.  thanks for reminding me :)
08:53 csharp berick++
08:56 dbwells eeevil: while we are housekeeping, I think the tags/rel_2_4_3 needs pushing as well?  No rush or anything, I just noticed a few days back it wasn't there.
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10:42 rjackson-isl EI down since 2:50 AM - kind of a gloomy day overall in Indiana!
10:42 jeff :-(
10:43 jeff what happened?
10:43 rjackson-isl fiber optic chomp! :-(
10:43 jeff ah. backhoe season is running long this year.
10:43 jeff never fun. sorry to hear that.
10:44 rjackson-isl yeah - at least we had one brick online so our utility server could do its thing...
10:44 rjackson-isl mrpeters++
10:44 mrpeters what happened bob?
10:44 mrpeters what can our guys do to help
10:44 mrpeters pm me if need be
10:44 rjackson-isl the physical line was cut between Henry st and Eastgate
10:45 rjackson-isl just in a holding pattern now
10:45 mrpeters AGAIN!?!?!?
10:45 rjackson-isl I ++ u mrpeters because you set up the bricks with one at Henry to avoid a bigger mess!
10:46 mrpeters ah, right on.   yeah....we did that after the LAST time they cut the fiber
10:46 mrpeters with a backhoe
10:46 mrpeters i bet u guys could survive on that one brick
10:46 rjackson-isl at least support is quiet - until the offline session uploads start frmo the 100 libraries...
10:47 mrpeters honestly...
10:47 mrpeters give it double ram, double CPU in the dom0 and try it
10:47 mrpeters those dom0's are so under utilized
10:48 mrpeters if it were nov 1 i would help you myself :)
11:07 dbs Tether the servers to LTE sticks?
11:09 mrpeters or find a data center that hires competent subs who don't dig into power lines and now fiber lines haha
11:10 rjackson-isl I would say mrpeters++ but that is probably politically incorrect! ;-)
11:10 mrpeters dont worry, i said it for you
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11:17 rjackson-isl official word is a downed AT&T pole...
11:17 mrpeters oh, so maybe it was a drunk driver :P
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11:24 JennB hello! im hunting the web url for downloading 2.4.2. I see the client's been updated to 2.4.3 but the link to 2.4.2 is now not on the web. Any help?
11:25 dbs JennB: you want the 2.4.2 client?
11:25 JennB yep!
11:26 dbs http://evergreen-ils.org/downl​oads/evergreen-setup-2.4.2.exe
11:26 JennB thanks!!!
11:26 JennB Im not seeing it here: http://evergreen-ils.org/egdow​nloads/windows-staff-clients/
11:27 dbs JennB: right, we can poke the web team / release managers about refining that process
11:35 Jaren joined #evergreen
11:40 jboyer-isl Protip: don't try to ls a dir on a non-responsive NFS mount. Hang time that would make Jordan jealous.
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11:49 moodaepo dbs: on it..sorry I must have missed it with the last update
12:05 bshum moodaepo++
12:34 csharp jboyer-isl++
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13:00 dbs moodaepo++
13:01 kmlussier Heads up! Web team meeting will be starting in a couple of minutes.
13:01 * kmlussier is running behind schedule.
13:02 kmlussier #startmeeting 2013-10-17 Web Team meeting
13:02 pinesol_green Meeting started Thu Oct 17 13:02:28 2013 US/Eastern.  The chair is kmlussier. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
13:02 pinesol_green Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
13:02 pinesol_green The meeting name has been set to '2013_10_17_web_team_meeting'
13:02 kmlussier #info Agenda is available at http://www.evergreen-ils.org/dokuwiki/doku​.php?id=webteam:meetings:agenda:2013-10-17
13:02 kmlussier #topic Introductions
13:03 kmlussier Please introduce yourselves with the #info command.
13:03 kmlussier #info kmlussier is Kathy Lussier, MassLNC
13:03 graced #info graced is Grace Dunbar, Equinox
13:03 kbutler #info is Kate Butler, Rodgers Memorial
13:04 bshum #info bshum is Ben Shum, Bibliomation (quasi-present)
13:04 RoganH #info RoganH, Rogan Hamby SCLENDS
13:04 kmlussier bshum should be focusing on his conference. :)
13:04 RoganH bshum needs to bring back Koha swag
13:05 kmlussier swag++
13:05 bshum kmlussier: I am... doing many things at once.
13:05 kmlussier A small group today. Let's see what we can get done with those of us who are here. People can continue introducing themselves as they arrive.
13:05 kmlussier #topic Action Items for Last Meeting
13:06 kmlussier The action items are 1) kmlussier to convert committes page to a WordPress page so that it can be included in the “get involved” section. 2)graced to do mockups for downloads page. 3) RoganH to continue roles discussion via e-mail on the web team list.
13:07 kmlussier #info kmlussier created a WordPress committees page at http://evergreen-ils.org/communicate/committees/
13:07 kmlussier For the most part, I kept it the same as the wiki page. However, I did change the introductory text and also updated the goals for the web team.
13:08 kmlussier I also added the page to the "Get Involved" menu.
13:08 StephenGWills joined #evergreen
13:09 kmlussier Any suggestions for changes are welcome. :)
13:09 kmlussier graced: Do you want to say anything about your action item?
13:09 graced #info graced sent out mockups of the download page to the web team mailing list
13:09 graced I think the mockup was received well
13:09 graced So the next step is to make it happen
13:10 graced And add more OpenSRF information to the download software page.
13:10 graced And I can work on that.
13:10 bshum graced++
13:11 kmlussier link: http://list.evergreen-ils.org/piperm​ail/evergreen-web-team/attachments/2​0131015/db191868/attachment-0001.pdf
13:11 graced kmlussier++ thank you
13:12 kmlussier graced++
13:12 kmlussier I like it.
13:13 graced It does highlight an issue we have to deal with repeatedly in the web site.
13:13 RoganH I do too.
13:13 RoganH graced++
13:13 graced We have two very different audiences.
13:14 graced I think, where it makes sense, we need to keep separation of the developer and librarian  pages.
13:14 kbutler graced++
13:14 graced We don't want to overwhelm someone looking to contribute to DIG, and we don't want to bore a developer.  ;-)
13:14 graced Or maybe I'm crazy.
13:15 kmlussier I think that makes sense. But in some areas, like the downloads page, it's difficult to separate the content on different pages.
13:15 graced Well, I do assume most librarians are looking for the staff client only - not OpenSRF or the software itself.  So we can do a little there.
13:16 RoganH I don't think it's a terrible thing to duplicate some stuff on different pages to have those audience portals
13:16 graced Mostly, we just need to have clarity.
13:18 kmlussier So how do we make these mock-ups happen? Do you want to work directly on that page graced?
13:18 graced I will work directly on that, yes.
13:19 kmlussier #action graced to update the downloads page to look like her mock-ups.
13:19 kmlussier RoganH: Do you have time to talk about your action item?
13:19 RoganH a little
13:20 RoganH unfortunately I haven't had the time to follow up but I've linked the original post in the agenda
13:20 RoganH and would still like to have a discussion and feedback
13:21 RoganH Does anyone have feedback at this time?
13:22 graced RoganH: I'd say fromt he attendence here, we might have to start smaller
13:22 graced and build up to that
13:22 RoganH graced: I agree.  And I proposed that some of those roles could probably be combined.
13:22 graced But I like the structure overall
13:22 RoganH If folks want I could come back next month with a new proposal combining some of the roles.
13:22 kbutler The structure was good. I wasn't clear on how the wiki played into things really.
13:23 RoganH The WIKI part is ... nebulous, to me at least.
13:23 kmlussier I agree with graced. I think getting a consistent corp of volunteers is tough because the community is still fairly small.
13:23 RoganH I put a few things later in the agenda to talk about it.
13:23 RoganH I've been getting some feedback from Erica who is quickly becoming both wiki wrangler and in general most knowledgeable person about it.
13:24 RoganH To me the WIKI is the wild west and demands little maintenance though what Erica is doing is crucial.
13:24 RoganH If we wanted a more structured and manicured WIKI ... that means a lot more involvement from the web team.
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13:24 kbutler My main thought is when does something need to be 'promoted' from the wiki to the site. Or is that even a goal?
13:25 RoganH That's an excellent question.
13:25 RoganH Do you mean, when we pull something out of the wild west and put it on display on the front web site, so to speak?
13:25 RoganH (I'm having images in my head of two headed buffalo on display in a New York museum.)
13:26 kbutler Yeah, basically. Or find it useful enough to incorporate into the documentation. Or something.
13:26 kbutler Is the wiki just a collection of random tidbits or a holding place for things we don't have a spot for yet?
13:26 StephenGWills a problem for the Wiki has always been it's haphazard index.  I always have thought that the website can offer structure that provides some of that indexing back into the wiki where appropriate.
13:27 graced So... why is there wiki structure in the web site and should it be a goal to incorporate it into the web site proper?
13:27 kmlussier We've been incorporating some wiki pages into the web site. But I think there's still a place for some pages that should always be wiki pages.
13:27 * dbs pops head in -- use piwik usage data to determine what might need to get surfaced higher?
13:27 graced kclussier: which ones do you see as the ones that should stay wiki?
13:28 RoganH Part of that depends on the scope of the web site and we've expanded the web site's scope some but I'm not sure it should incorporate everything in the wiki which is pretty much anything Evergreen.
13:28 graced er kmlussier: ^
13:28 kmlussier Things like the magic spells page should remain a wiki page.
13:28 RoganH kmlussier: I agree - things with many many contributors and editors should be wiki
13:28 graced I could see that.
13:28 kmlussier And most of the committee pages are wiki pages. It makes it easier for anyone to add minutes and the like.
13:28 graced That makes sense to me
13:28 RoganH I like Dan's idea as well.
13:28 dbs also wiki vs. web site vs. docs :)
13:28 kmlussier dbs++
13:28 kbutler dbs++
13:29 RoganH So, 1) guideline of many editors/contributors stays wiki, 2) look at stats for what could go to web site because it needs to be found easily
13:29 RoganH then hash it out case by case if we need to?
13:29 kmlussier Do we still have a lot of wiki documentation? If so, I would like to see that converted into wiki docs.
13:30 kmlussier I mean, official docs.
13:30 graced I don't think we do.
13:31 RoganH kmlussier: I don't think so but really don't know for sure.
13:32 StephenGWills The biggest issue for me as a use case is the lack of a process for deprecating information on the wiki (or my lack of understand of the existing deprecation process if it exists)
13:32 kmlussier Does somebody want to look at those stats and come back to the next meeting on recommendations of content that should be upgraded to official web site content?
13:32 kmlussier StephenGWills: I agree, but I think Erica made a good start.
13:32 * dbs poked the wiki, doesn't think that piwik is plugged into it yet
13:33 RoganH So, we would need to plug it in and build stats from this time forward.
13:33 kmlussier Didn't Erica have a list of content that needed to be updated/deprecated? I thought I saw it, but I'm not seeing it now.
13:33 RoganH StephenGWills: Erica at ESI  has been doing some work trying to flag information that may be old and of concern but it's not being deprecated yet (as I would use the term)
13:34 RoganH http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?id=scr​atchpad:pages_that_need_updating_or_revising
13:34 kmlussier RoganH: Thaks!
13:34 kmlussier #link http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?id=scr​atchpad:pages_that_need_updating_or_revising
13:35 RoganH This is jumping ahead but I also proposed we put a banner on the page like this:
13:35 RoganH https://wiki.archlinux.org/in​dex.php/Template:Out_of_date
13:35 RoganH #link https://wiki.archlinux.org/in​dex.php/Template:Out_of_date
13:35 kmlussier The question I have is who makes the decision that a wiki page from that list should be deprecated. For example, I would recommend getting rid of http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/do​ku.php?id=scratchpad:acq_serials
13:36 graced kmlussier:  How about archiving for historical purposes instead of getting rid of?
13:36 kbutler RoganH: I like the banner idea. At the top, though.
13:36 RoganH With it being a wiki technically anyone can but we're obviously trying to not be cavalier with other people's work.
13:36 graced but yes, it is very out of date
13:36 RoganH I think the banner is a way of at least warning people.
13:37 bhyman joined #evergreen
13:37 RoganH But I also think we could have another banner that says "if this isn't updated it will be removed", put it on a list for removal after X days and then do so.
13:37 RoganH or use a voting mechanism.  I think I've seen as many mechanisms as n - 2 where n = number of wikis in the world
13:38 StephenGWills heh.
13:39 RoganH I'm in favor of the flagging for eventual removal approach so that if someone is passionate about it they can have a chance to update it.
13:39 RoganH And if no one cares it can go away.
13:39 StephenGWills If we have an archived section, a process that empowers a group, like the web group to mark something as going to archive in…say… a month if no one objects and then it being moved into archive seems like a reasonable approach?
13:39 kmlussier I don't know the best way to handle this, but I would love to see a process where people who are experts in a certain area carefully reviewed the flagged pages.
13:39 graced We can nag.
13:40 RoganH kmlussier: I would too but that manpower limitation is the ... well, issue.
13:40 StephenGWills that way, if someone REALLY has to have an old piece of content, they can go get it and restore it.
13:40 bshum dbs: Piwik used to track the wiki.  I suspect that we lost it during the transition to wordpress and knocking off the old headers/footers.  The wiki itself, I'd like to see some new theming for eventually.
13:40 kmlussier I looking at that acq/serials page more closely, I can see there are links that might still be useful. Like the link to sample sets of serials patterns. So those links need to be put elsewhere or the page needs a new purpose.
13:40 * dbs is in favour of deleting with very little prejudice, rather than letting outdated / incorrect info be found in search engines
13:40 RoganH graced: I think that if we made a list of articles ready for archiving we could also send out that list once a month.
13:40 RoganH graced: and nag folks :)
13:40 graced I just don't want to lose the history of Evergreen.
13:41 graced I think that would work, Rogan
13:41 StephenGWills I wonder if you can bat robots away from a section of a wiki?
13:41 StephenGWills you must be able to.
13:41 RoganH I'm not in favor of archiving either in this case but I will go with majority vote.
13:41 dbs StephenGWills: you can prevent access to particular pages, sure
13:41 RoganH Or if we archived do it in some way that won't confuse things.  I don't have any bright ideas there.
13:42 dbs archive = copy the filesystem into git on a monthly basis?
13:42 RoganH I'm amiable to that idea, blocking the deprecated pages, essentially archiving them.
13:42 dbs good thing about dokuwiki is that it's purely file-based
13:42 graced I'm in favor of archiving somehow as long as it isn't searchable.  Git would work.
13:42 StephenGWills heh… delete with prejudice and point objectors to the Internet Archive? :)
13:42 RoganH dbs: it's just flat ascii right?
13:43 kbutler saving a copy not in the live wiki seems reasonable
13:43 dbs RoganH: flat text files (can include unicode - :) ) and whatever files people have uploaded
13:43 kmlussier OK, so we're looking at the wiki wrangler putting out regular e-mails with a list of pages that either need updating or removing. People have 30 days to review it and, unless the content is updated, we archive it into git? And nagging will be part of this process.
13:43 bshum The wiki also tracks history if you go back to see recent changes on any given page.  So even if a page is "deleted" if you can find the exact URL and then click through the history, you can see it.  (not sure how far back that goes, but it doesn't seem to have limits)
13:44 RoganH Are we proposing moving the whole wiki, a snapshot of it, to GIT everymonth before removing deprecated content?
13:44 kmlussier I thought the page was gone for good once it was deleted.
13:44 graced RoganH: that was my understanding
13:45 RoganH graced: OK.  Just trying to be clear for the record. I'm very slow after all.  :)
13:45 graced hardly
13:45 bshum kmlussier: An example of a page I "deleted" a few weeks ago - http://wiki.evergreen-ils.org/doku.php?do​=revisions&id=acq%3Aedi_configuration
13:45 kmlussier OK, then change what I said. If people don't update it in 30 days, it gets deleted.
13:45 roses joined #evergreen
13:45 bshum acq:edi_configuration is in the official docs, so I "removed" it.  But if you remember the exact page, it's still retrievable via the "old revisions" link
13:45 RoganH lol
13:46 RoganH So, I propose that we flag pages with two kinds of banners.
13:46 kmlussier Does the process I outlined above reflect what we've been saying?
13:46 RoganH 1) Needs attention, but not flagged for removal.  2) Inaccurate content that is flagged for removal in 30 days.
13:46 graced +1
13:46 kbutler +1
13:46 RoganH We keep separate lists of each type and send out both each month to the lists.
13:47 kmlussier +1
13:47 RoganH This builds on what Erica has already started.
13:47 RoganH +1
13:48 StephenGWills +1
13:48 RoganH If there are no more votes I will consider that passed.
13:48 kmlussier #agree Wiki wrangler(s) will flag pages with two kinds of banners: ) Needs attention, but not flagged for removal.  2) Inaccurate content that is flagged for removal in 30 days. The wrangler will send out both lists to the listserv on a monthly. Content with the second type of flag will be removed if it hasn't been updated within 30 days.
13:48 kmlussier I hope I got that right.
13:49 RoganH Looks good to me.
13:49 kmlussier OK, moving on. We may need to stop the meetig before we get through everythig.
13:49 RoganH We talked ahead a good bit though.
13:49 kmlussier I'm going to skip the next agenda item and bring the discussion back to the list if we don't get to it today.
13:49 kmlussier #topic Grace asked about doing more mockups versus experimenting with the page.
13:50 kmlussier Is that in regards to the downloads page (which we already discussed) or is it a more general question?
13:50 RoganH I think that was discussed earlier.
13:50 graced I'm happy to mock things up for review  for anything if we want to do that.
13:50 RoganH She already said she would work directly on it so that's resolved.
13:50 RoganH Nah, just do it.  Rapid prototyping in production.  :)
13:50 * kmlussier agrees with RoganH
13:51 * gmcharlt echoes "agree, agree"
13:51 RoganH new items 3 & 4 are resolved as well I think
13:51 kmlussier RoganH: Would you say items 3 and 4 on the agenda have been covered then?
13:51 kmlussier OK, then I'll go back to mine.
13:51 RoganH kmlussier: yes
13:51 kmlussier #topic Potential accessibility issues with “Learn More” buttons
13:52 kmlussier Alexey mentioned this on the web team mailing list, and, after following up with his links ad doing more research, I think he's right.
13:52 graced Don't screen readers pull from the alt-text tag?
13:52 kmlussier Using "Learn More" for those buttons can be ambiguous for users with screen readers who might be listing links on a page. All they will hear is "Learn More," "Learn More" without any context.
13:53 kmlussier graced: They do when there is an image with an alt tag. But these aren't images. They are using CSS styling.
13:53 gmcharlt the idea would be to use more specific action verbs?
13:53 graced kmlussier: ah, thanks for the explanation
13:53 bshum That text is customizable I believe, but it's shared by every button on that particular landing page.
13:53 bshum or at least that's how it works in the default theming
13:54 kmlussier gmcharlt: I think so. There is a title for each of those links that is more specific, but apparently screen readers don't read title by default.
13:54 kbutler I do think the learn more buttons are appropriate for sighted users, though.
13:54 bshum Yeah "button text" is a single shared variable for the theme.
13:55 kmlussier bshum: Yes, I had looked at the them a little too. I didn't see a way to easily address the issue there.
13:55 kmlussier s/them/theme
13:55 graced So, we have to use something else.
13:56 kmlussier Anyway, I don't think it's something we can totally resolve now with just 4 minutes left of meeting time, but maybe it's something we can look at over the next month?
13:56 kbutler I like the suggestion of using hidden text just for screenreaders, but that won't work if the button text is global.
13:56 kbutler kmlussier++
13:56 kmlussier I'll add it as an action item for myself to look at it. Or to bug bshum about it. ;)
13:57 RoganH Agreed, let's continue to look this month at it to try to find the best solution rather than rush it right now.
13:57 graced Replace it with cats!
13:57 kmlussier #action kmlussier to explore options for the "Learn More" buttons on the Evergreen home page.
13:57 kmlussier Anything else?
13:58 kmlussier #endmeeting
13:58 pinesol_green Meeting ended Thu Oct 17 13:58:10 2013 US/Eastern.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
13:58 pinesol_green Minutes:        http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2013/evergreen.2013-10-17-13.02.html
13:58 pinesol_green Minutes (text): http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2013/evergreen.2013-10-17-13.02.txt
13:58 pinesol_green Log:            http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergree​n/2013/evergreen.2013-10-17-13.02.log.html
13:58 kmlussier Thanks everyone!
13:58 StephenGWills tx++
13:58 graced kmlussier++
13:58 gmcharlt kmlussier++
13:59 kbutler kmlussier++
13:59 montgoc1 joined #evergreen
13:59 RoganH kmlussier++
13:59 ElizabethM_ joined #evergreen
14:01 bhyman g'day - EOB meeting will commence here in a moment
14:02 bhyman #startmeeting Evergreen Oversight Board Meeting, 17 October 2013
14:02 pinesol_green Meeting started Thu Oct 17 14:02:39 2013 US/Eastern.  The chair is bhyman. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:02 pinesol_green Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
14:02 pinesol_green The meeting name has been set to 'evergreen_oversight_board​_meeting__17_october_2013'
14:03 bhyman #topic introductions
14:03 RoganH #info RoganH = Rogan Hamby, SCLENDS
14:03 bhyman EOB members, please intro yourself with #info
14:03 pinesol_green [evergreen|Remington Steed] Fixing little problems in Serials docs - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=3dd5ec0>
14:03 montgoc1 #info montgoc1 = Chauncey Montgomery, Consortium of Ohio Libraries
14:04 ElizabethM_ #info ElizabethM = Elizabeth McKinney GPLS/PINES
14:04 bhyman #info bhyman = Ben Hyman BC Libraries Cooperative
14:04 kmlussier #info kmlussier is Kathy Lussier, MassLNC
14:04 yboston #info yboston - Yamil Suarez - Berklee College of Music - Evergreen Oversight Board
14:04 dbwells #info dbwells = Dan Wells, Hekman Library (Calvin College)
14:04 afterl #info afterl - Amy Terlaga, Bibliomation (guest)
14:05 bhyman Hi all - good to see you - quorum achieved
14:05 bhyman #topic Action items from previous meeting
14:07 bhyman ps - Galen asked me to step in re: his - er - junket in Reno ;)
14:07 StephenGWills #info Stephen Wills, Maine Balsam Consortium
14:07 kmlussier Heh
14:08 bhyman I see the only actions from last meeting relating to themerchandising topic later on our agenda. Am I missing anything?
14:08 * kmlussier is looking
14:09 kmlussier bhyman: Yup. I think you're right.
14:09 bhyman kmlussier +1
14:09 bhyman #topic  Financial Report
14:10 bhyman #action gmcharlt will send after meeting
14:10 bhyman #topic  Evergreen 2.5 Release Manager's update (Dan Wells)
14:11 gmcharlt #info Galen Charlton, ESI (multi-tasking)
14:11 dbwells #info We had a fair amount of testing and bugfixing during the 2.5 beta, which extended it by about a week.
14:12 dbwells #info After things settled down, 2.5-rc1 was cut on Monday, Oct. 15.
14:12 dbwells #info Given the level of testing done for the beta, I am hopeful that RC1 will be short, with no surprises.
14:12 dbwells Any questions?
14:13 yboston dbwells++
14:13 StephenGWills for those of us not paying attention, when does 2.3 stop being supported?
14:14 dbwells StephenGWills: I believe it gets security fixes only for 6 months after 2.5 final is released.
14:14 StephenGWills does that happen as part of 2.5 going to prod?
14:14 StephenGWills nod
14:15 ElizabethM_ dbwells ++
14:15 bhyman dbwells++
14:15 bhyman ok, moving on
14:15 bhyman #topic  Evergreen 2014 Conference Committee Report (Kathy Lussier)
14:17 kmlussier The deadline for conference proposals is quickly approaching. We've only received a couple of proposals at this time, but I expect we'll get an influx closer to the deadline.
14:17 kmlussier Nevertheless, I think it's time to start prodding people.
14:17 afterl kmlussier:  I have a reminder set to go out on Monday
14:17 kmlussier afterl++
14:17 RoganH kmlussier: are there any areas in particular you want more proposals?
14:17 kmlussier Registrations are also coming fairly slowly.
14:18 ElizabethM_ How many do we have registered so far?
14:18 kmlussier RoganH: I would say any of the areas that were identified in our pre-planning survey results. We listed them at http://evergreen-ils.org/c​onference/eg14/proposals/
14:19 montgoc1 I saw that list. Are there any topics that need covered more than others?
14:20 kmlussier ElizabethM_: I'm having trouble logging into the site to check on the number. But I can send it out the board after the meeting.
14:21 kmlussier montgoc1: It's hard to say. We will be sharing these proposals with the community to get their feedback to see what they most want to attend. I wo uld say if there is anything that jumps out at you from that list, go with it.
14:21 kmlussier There were some people who indicated in the pre-planning survey that they would be willing to present on something, so I'll be following up with them directly.
14:22 ElizabethM_ kmlussier: it is still early for registrations. I think you will see an influx after the holidays.
14:22 kmlussier We also have a verbal agreement with a keynote speaker. I'm just waiting for the signed agreement before posting an announcement.
14:22 kmlussier ElizabethM_: I agree. I also know that some people start their fiscal year in January, which may be when they have the funds for conferences.
14:22 kmlussier afterl: Do you want to talk about sponsorships?
14:22 afterl Sure.
14:23 afterl We're redoubling our efforts re: sponsorships.
14:23 afterl As you know, I have asked for help from the EOB.
14:23 afterl I have received several emails - volunteers.
14:23 afterl I am currently following up.
14:24 afterl The Massachusetts folks have been very generous.
14:24 afterl MassLNC, NOBLE, and MVLC have all sponsored something.
14:24 afterl I'll keep at it.
14:25 afterl That's all for now unless there are questions.
14:25 StephenGWills MA++ ;)
14:25 kmlussier Just an FYI, the current sponsorship list is posted at http://evergreen-ils.org/con​ference/eg14/eg14-sponsors/
14:25 afterl kmlussier:  thanks for sharing that
14:26 kmlussier ElizabethM_: We have 7 registrations so far.
14:26 bhyman kmlussier++ after1++ looking forward to EG2014! If it helps, registrations & sponsorhsips for EG2013 didn't pile on until late-ish
14:26 afterl bhyman:  good to know!
14:27 kmlussier bhyman: Thanks for that info! :)
14:27 afterl and thanks to BC Libraries Cooperative for their sponsorship!
14:27 * StephenGWills is called away, sorry guys.
14:28 bhyman ok
14:28 bhyman #topic  Merchandising (Rogan Hamby)
14:29 RoganH Well.... I sent out the proposal late last week.
14:29 RoganH Has everyone had a chance to look at it?
14:30 montgoc1 Yes.
14:30 gmcharlt yes
14:31 RoganH I would like to invite comments and feedback and if there aren't any formally propose it.
14:31 yboston I read it and it seemed fine to me
14:31 bhyman yes
14:31 bhyman #info Rogan's proposal http://list.evergreen-ils.org/pipermail/eg​-oversight-board/2013-October/000612.html
14:31 montgoc1 It looked good to me also.
14:31 RoganH thanks bhyman
14:31 kmlussier +1
14:32 RoganH I would like to propose it mr chairman and request a vote.
14:33 bhyman Any questions for RoganH before we proceed to a vote?
14:33 kmlussier Nothing from me.
14:35 ElizabethM_ joined #evergreen
14:35 bhyman keyboard walked away for a moment - standby
14:36 bhyman Hearing no questions, a motion to move forward on the proposal has been made
14:36 bhyman #startvote Yes, No, Abstain
14:36 pinesol_green Unable to parse vote topic and options.
14:37 bhyman trying that again
14:38 bhyman #startvote Does the Board authorize implementation of the merchandising proposal - http://list.evergreen-ils.org/pipermail/eg​-oversight-board/2013-October/000612.html? Yes, No, Abstain
14:38 pinesol_green Begin voting on: Does the Board authorize implementation of the merchandising proposal - http://list.evergreen-ils.org/pipermail/eg​-oversight-board/2013-October/000612.html? Valid vote options are Yes, No, Abstain.
14:38 pinesol_green Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts.
14:38 kmlussier bhyman++
14:38 montgoc1 #vote Yes
14:38 kmlussier #vote Yes
14:38 RoganH #vote yes
14:38 ElizabethM_ #vote yes
14:39 yboston #vote yes
14:39 bhyman #vote yes
14:41 bhyman just double checking quorum/voting...standby
14:41 bhyman and we're good
14:41 bhyman #endvote
14:41 pinesol_green Voted on "Does the Board authorize implementation of the merchandising proposal - http://list.evergreen-ils.org/pipermail/eg​-oversight-board/2013-October/000612.html?" Results are
14:41 pinesol_green Yes (6): kmlussier, yboston, RoganH, ElizabethM_, montgoc1, bhyman
14:41 kmlussier RoganH++ Thanks for moving this forward!
14:42 gmcharlt (FTR, a 'yes' from me)
14:42 RoganH certainly.  I'm still waiting to hear back from the conservancy on setting up the Amazon and Zazzle accounts but it hasn't been that long.  I will report back at the next meeting on that as well.
14:42 bhyman RoganH++ we can task you with related action for the next meeting?
14:43 RoganH Sure.  I will cal for volunteers and start putting the group together to be reviewed at the next meeting.
14:43 bhyman #action RoganH will provide an update on the mercahndising proposal at the next EOB meeting
14:44 bhyman #action RoganH will call for volunteers and report at the next EOB meeting
14:44 bhyman moving on
14:45 bhyman #topic  Tony Sebro's request to register the literal trademark for Evergreen
14:45 RoganH Was there any feedback from GPLS about why this either wasn't attempted before or if it was why it didn't succeed?
14:46 RoganH I'm in favor of doing it now, just curious if there was historical information we should consider.
14:47 gmcharlt from the correspondance I've seen, they're still in the process of investigating
14:47 ElizabethM_ I have not heard back from the legal staff at Board of Regents.  Our lawyer was going to inquire with the folks they contract to do this work.
14:48 gmcharlt I suggest that we give authorization for the mark to be registered (at a cost of $275), which Tony can exercise at his discretion depending on the results of his inquiries
14:48 RoganH I would second that as a proposal.
14:49 bhyman Thanks all for updates. I like the suggestion from gmcharlt. standby for a vote (or please interject in the interim)
14:50 bhyman #startvote Does the EOB authorize SFC to expend funds ($275) at its discretion to register the literal trademark for Evergreen? Yes, No, Abstain
14:50 pinesol_green Begin voting on: Does the EOB authorize SFC to expend funds ($275) at its discretion to register the literal trademark for Evergreen? Valid vote options are Yes, No, Abstain.
14:50 pinesol_green Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts.
14:51 RoganH #vote Yes
14:51 gmcharlt #vote Yes
14:51 montgoc1 #vote Yes
14:51 bhyman #vote Yes
14:51 yboston #vote yes
14:51 kmlussier #vote Yes
14:52 bhyman #endvote
14:52 pinesol_green Voted on "Does the EOB authorize SFC to expend funds ($275) at its discretion to register the literal trademark for Evergreen?" Results are
14:52 pinesol_green Yes (6): kmlussier, yboston, RoganH, montgoc1, gmcharlt, bhyman
14:53 bhyman #action gmcharlt to discuss with Tony (?)
14:53 gmcharlt bhyman: correct -- I'll send a formal response
14:54 bhyman gmcharlt++
14:54 bhyman #topic  Eventbrite sponsorship and request for mention in conference email(s)
14:55 RoganH I have to admit I'm feeling in favor of this.  Aside from registration savings I don't see the harm in allowing them this kind of sponsorship role.
14:55 gmcharlt the only unusual thing wrt to sponsorship benefits is the requst for mention in one or more conference emails
14:56 yboston I am not 100% clear of what will have to be included in our emails
14:56 yboston a short paragraph mentioning that they are a sponsor and what services they offer?
14:56 RoganH I was under the impression it would be something like "Eventbrite is a sponsor of the 2014 Evergreen Conference."
14:56 RoganH Do we need clarification on what the exact requirements are?
14:57 kmlussier It also involves a link back to the Eventbrite web site.
14:57 ElizabethM_ I am in favor as long as we treat all of our sponsors (based on sponsorship levels of course) equally.
14:57 mrpeters left #evergreen
14:58 RoganH Will there be an issue because that wasn't an advertised benefit of sponsorship for the other kinds up to this point?
14:58 bhyman Tony's email says: "inclusion in emails: a short blurb about Eventbrite, and a link back to their website."; to be consistent on this, perhaps we could instead say that all conference emails will thank the conference sponsors (with a link back to the conference sponsor web page)
14:59 kmlussier As I mentioned in my e-mail, the fees could up up to somewhere around $1,500. For similarly priced sponsorships, we are giving things like conference registrations, which could be seen as a larger benefit than getting a mention in an e-mail.
14:59 kmlussier I also have no problem with mentioning all coference sponsors in the e-mail. Since we didn't advertise it as a benefit for a particular level of sponsorship, I think we would have to do it for everyone.
15:00 montgoc1 Is Eventbrite also giving us a discount on registration fees?
15:00 RoganH They are waiving the fees as I understand.
15:01 RoganH Hence the savings kmlussier mentioned.
15:01 montgoc1 Does that warrant some kind of extra recognition?
15:01 kmlussier Yes, that's what they have done for previous conferences. I believe the fees are 2% of the registration fee.
15:02 kmlussier bhyman: Is the logo placement on the conference web site and the signage at the event somethig you did for Eventbrite in return for waiving the fees?
15:04 bhyman kmlussier For EG2013, Eventbrite didn't request specific recognition; rather - IIRC, the arrangement was between SFC and EventBrite. In retrospect, interesting this didn't come up
15:05 kmlussier montgoc1: The waiving of registration fees is the only benefit Eventbrite gives for their sponsorship. In return they are asking for a logo on the web site, signage at the event, and the inclusion in e-mails sent to attendees. I don't know if that answers your question.
15:05 bhyman Tony wondered specifically "how [the EOB] feels about the prospects of including a blurb about Eventbrite in any, some, or all of your conference email blasts.
15:06 bhyman Are we comfortable in proposing that all conference emails will recognize the conference sponsors writ large, with a link back to the EG2014 sponsor page?
15:06 RoganH I am.
15:06 kmlussier I am.
15:06 gmcharlt I am too
15:06 montgoc1 I like that approach.  Will that satisfy Eventbrite?
15:07 gmcharlt that idea addresses my main reservation of dealing with the broader issue of being consistent for all sponsors
15:07 rfrasur joined #evergreen
15:07 bhyman ok - suggest we relay this back to Tony and he can run it up the pole
15:07 afterl I like this approach.
15:08 bhyman (assuming we don't need a vote) #action gmcharlt to discuss with Tony
15:08 rfrasur Is there a meeting going on?
15:08 kmlussier rfrasur: Yes, but it's almost done.
15:09 bhyman #topic Next Meeting
15:09 rfrasur no worries.  Just curious.
15:09 bhyman Next EOB meeting is scheduled for Thursday, 21 November 2013 at 14:00 Eastern
15:09 bhyman If there is no further business...
15:09 kmlussier Briefly
15:10 bhyman The floor is yours
15:10 kmlussier I'm going to bring up the 2015 conference selection via e-mail. I dropped the ball on it last month, but I think we need to get moving on this soon.
15:10 kmlussier That's all. Sorry I didn't add it to the agenda.
15:10 bhyman #topic EG2015 selection committee
15:10 bhyman kmlussier++
15:11 ElizabethM_ kmlussier ++
15:11 bhyman #action kmlussier 2015 conference selection email forthcoming
15:11 bhyman thanks all - until next time
15:12 ElizabethM_ bhyman ++
15:12 montgoc1 bhyman++
15:12 afterl bhyman++
15:12 gmcharlt (confirming that I'll discuss with Tony, and now I turn into a pumpkin for a little bit -- thanks for putting up with my jumping in and out of the meeting)
15:12 gmcharlt bhyman++
15:12 kmlussier bhyman++ Nice job for a first-time go-around with meetbot! :)
15:13 stevenyvr2 joined #evergreen
15:13 bhyman your patience is appreciated
15:13 bhyman #endmeeting
15:13 pinesol_green Meeting ended Thu Oct 17 15:13:48 2013 US/Eastern.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
15:13 pinesol_green Minutes:        http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2013/evergreen.2013-10-17-14.02.html
15:13 pinesol_green Minutes (text): http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2013/evergreen.2013-10-17-14.02.txt
15:13 pinesol_green Log:            http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergree​n/2013/evergreen.2013-10-17-14.02.log.html
15:23 RoganH bhyman++
15:23 RoganH thanks for running the meeting
15:25 kmlussier I have a question about adding search indexes. We have a consortium that wants to make the publisher field indexed for keyword searches. They added 260b config.metabib_field with a class of keyword. If they do a search just for the publisher, the record comes up. However, if they add other keywords to the search, it doesnn't come up.
15:25 kmlussier Is that a result of the combined seach issue as described by eeevil at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ever​green/+bug/1169693/comments/2?
15:25 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1169693 in Evergreen "keyword relevancy ranking in 2.4" (affected: 1, heat: 6) [Medium,Fix released]
15:29 csharp @karma
15:29 pinesol_green csharp: Highest karma: "dbs" (720), "bshum" (593), and "tsbere" (559).  Lowest karma: "ie" (-48), "^" (-25), and "----------------------------------" (-18).  You (csharp) are ranked 12 out of 2024.
15:29 jeff kmlussier: I believe it's related. You could either move away from the "big blob of keywords" index definition, or you could change the xpath that the big blob definition uses, so that it does not exclude OriginInfo
15:30 rfrasur --------------------------------?  funny
15:30 eeevil kmlussier: short answer: "result of" is a bit strong, but yes, it's strongly related. one could /also/ remove the "but not originInfo" part of the xpath for keyword|keyword in this specific case to work around the issue
15:30 eeevil heh ... jeff beat me to it :)
15:30 csharp and "^" is because people use "^--" to say "hey looky here" a lot
15:30 jeff and i was not completely inaccurate -- yay!
15:30 jeff eeevil++
15:30 kmlussier I don't think we want to remove exclusion for origininfo. Then we would have "new york" being indexed for everthing published in new york.
15:31 eeevil kmlussier: right :)
15:31 * kmlussier shudders at that thought.
15:31 jeff depending on how much MODS leaves in originInfo, you might be able to more carefully exclude city but leave publisher name.
15:31 * jeff looks
15:31 jeff i suspect that the context is gone
15:32 eeevil actually, you can do it
15:32 jeff nope, i'm wrong -- and happily so!
15:32 jeff you could exclude originInfo/place while keeping originInfo/publisher
15:32 jeff dateIssued and issuance and potentially others could be included/excluded also
15:33 kmlussier Yes, I think I see what you're saying.
15:33 eeevil I think just excluding originInfo/place instead of originInfo would be spot on
15:34 * eeevil checks mods 3.2 (was looking at 3.5)
15:34 kmlussier I'm looking at 3.2
15:34 jeff there are several dates that might or might not be useful.
15:35 jeff also, edition, issuance, frequency, and language
15:35 eeevil kmlussier: cool. I'll leave it to you two, then
15:35 kmlussier I'll have to check with them. I don't know if they want to bring along that other stuff from origininfo or not.
15:36 kmlussier It seems like it would be fairly easy to only exclude originInfo/place. I'm not sure how I would go about saying exclude all origininfo except publisher.
15:36 kmlussier But I guess I need to find out what they want first.
15:36 kmlussier eeevil++ jeff++ Thanks!
15:53 rfrasur It's worth saying that talking to other library directors about technology often feels like an incursion into unfriendly territory.  They also look at me funny.
15:53 * rfrasur has feelings too.
15:58 phasefx rfrasur++
15:59 rfrasur that's okay.  they didn't actually hurt the aforementioned feelings.  it just always surprises me that others don't know stuff and aren't excited about it.
16:09 mrpeters joined #evergreen
16:26 rfrasur I thought when uploading offline transactions, you could create one file and have all the workstations upload to it...and then process everything from elsewhere...but does each workstation have to create their own file to upload to?  That's what we do because it works....but I thought the other worked too.
16:27 rfrasur or...create one sessions...not file.
16:28 jboyer-isl rfrasur: You can upload the transactions from multiple machines into a single session, then process them all at once.
16:28 jeff what jboyer-isl said is what we did when we used offline transations.
16:29 jboyer-isl Both ways work, but with the multiple uploads you can have someone like the circ manager create the sessions ahead of time (if it's a planned outage) and then any staff can upload to the session after things are back up.
16:29 rfrasur jboyer-isl: when I created the session at one workstation....and then go to another and select the session, the upload button isn't active
16:29 rfrasur (that's a good idea about creating sessions beforehand)
16:30 rfrasur I know you're heading out the door.  I'll deal with later.
16:34 afterl left #evergreen
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16:52 montgoc1 joined #evergreen
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23:36 RBecker joined #evergreen

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