Evergreen ILS Website

IRC log for #evergreen, 2013-08-23

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All times shown according to the server's local time.

Time Nick Message
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07:17 dbs well bshum, you wanted another commit, I gave you another one--to define contributors more tightly
07:18 dbs in a demonstration of just how messed up google's rich snippets tool is, using resource attributes to anchor the contributor to a page instead of a search URL makes the rich snippets tool error go away
07:19 dbs so you can either set a specific price for an offer, _or_ use resource/about attributes for contributors instead of relying on the search URL; both make google happy. Nonsensical
07:20 dbs I can see the search URL - which would lead to a 404 on stuff.coffeecode.net - making Rich Snippets unhappy; but as to why adding price to an Offer makes it equally happy? Crazy. Maybe it has an error stack limit of 1 :)
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09:28 rfrasur there should be a law against titling a book using the same word three times
09:29 kmlussier Agenda for next week's dev meeting is at http://evergreen-ils.org/dokuwiki/d​oku.php?id=dev:meetings:2013-08-27. It needs topics.
09:39 jboyer-isl rfrasur: Beetlejuice?
09:39 rfrasur hah, no.  "happy, happy, happy"
09:40 rfrasur because happy is such a distinct word....and saying it three times really makes a diff when searching an ILS
09:40 jcamins rfrasur: I'm going to have to blame the ILS.
09:40 rfrasur and apparently even librarians forget the quotation marks do wonders :p
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09:40 rfrasur jcamins: yes, but that's fairly basic searching
09:43 jboyer-isl I saw that email finally. To be honest, since I never got into the Duck Dynasty stuff, maybe the patrons are being done a favor?
09:43 jcamins rfrasur: the quotation marks? Sure, but Evergreen (and many other ILSes) offers relevancy boosting, so if a search for "happy happy happy" without quotation marks doesn't bring up the Happy, happy, happy book first, the relevancy weighting should probably be adjusted such that it does.
09:43 jcamins Though, that said, "Happy, happy, happy" is a silly name because no one will be able to remember it.
09:44 kmlussier eeevil was talking about adding phrase relevance bumps the other day, along with word order and first word. I think that would help in this scenario.
09:44 rfrasur jcamins: agreed on all points.
09:45 rfrasur jboyer-isl: it's really popular here (keeping in mind that I just had to explain that the screaming my assistant was hearing were the roosters in the neighbors backyard)
09:45 kmlussier Well, I meant to say eeevil and dbs.
09:45 kmlussier I'm not sure I understand how first word is helpful as a bump.
09:45 rfrasur kmlussier++ #I do remember that discussion
09:46 jcamins kmlussier: if you're searching by title, chances are good you start with the first word.
09:46 rfrasur jboyer-isl: personally, I think we have enough live performances of "downhome" behavior around here to not need to watch it on tv.
09:47 kmlussier jcamins: Sure, that makes sense.
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09:49 jboyer-isl Ah, but DD is a real-life Beverly Hillbillies. Better writing than the local fare.
09:49 rfrasur jboyer-isl: :-|
09:50 jboyer-isl Not sure how to take your :-|
09:50 rfrasur it was the only response I could muster.
09:51 * rfrasur will buy the books
09:51 * rfrasur will buy the DVDs
09:51 * rfrasur will say what nice families they are
09:51 rfrasur that is all
09:52 rfrasur for the library, btw.  not for myself.
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10:00 rfrasur I'm not understanding this outcry re: gmail and ILS in general.  Is it just the season to worry about email providers or has something happened?
10:04 jboyer-isl Recently gmail decided that a lot of lib notices were either spam or belonged in one of their new smart categories (which appear as different "tabs" in your inbox). For most people, if it's not on the "main" inbox tab, it doesn't exist.
10:05 rfrasur ahhh, and I haven't had the tabs show up yet in my inbox (or I told them to go away at some point)
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10:05 rfrasur and we don't use a .lib url anymore either.  Must be why our patrons aren't complaining...yet.
10:06 jboyer-isl Click the Gear menu and then Configure Inbox.
10:06 jboyer-isl Your patrons might not always get their holds/pre-due/etc. notices from us though, because it's our server that sends out hundreds of very similar looking messages each day.
10:07 jboyer-isl Well, gmail users get them, but they may not notice. Hotmail was actively dropping them (not in spam folders, just plain gone).
10:07 rfrasur oh, I gotcha.  They're coming from evergreen.lib.in.us
10:09 rfrasur (what have I just done to my inbox...the insanity)
10:10 jboyer-isl Oh, I should have told you not to click Apply. You can probably turn it back off, or just uncheck everything except Primary.
10:12 * rfrasur wishes ctrl+z worked for everything in life
10:13 rfrasur fixed...though the tabs have potential for another day
10:14 berick bshum: moodaepo: evergreen-ils.org downloads is ready for 2.3.10 if one of you would be so kind
10:15 jeff_ i've been using the new tabbed inbox and like it.
10:15 jeff_ for my work google apps account i'm using primary/promotions/forums
10:16 jeff_ for personal, i have the full primary/social/promotions/updates/forums
10:19 rfrasur jeff_: I might actually work on configuring it to truly sort things, but it'll take more attention than I can give at this moment.  All my email dumps into one inbox
10:22 pinesol_green [evergreen_website|Anoop Atre] Downloads - Evergreen 2.3.10 release updated - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=Ever​green_Website.git;a=commit;h=95c4847>
10:23 berick moodaepo++ thanks
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10:27 sal_ Trying to install opensrf 2.2 on Ubuntu 12.04, and it's griping about not being able to find Unix/Syslog.pm when I launch osrf_ctl.sh.  Did I miss a step in the install?  (I've had to add a whole bunch of packages as part of the installation process, but that's on Ubuntu...)
10:27 rfrasur RoganH: A note about cafepress that you may already know.  For their basic shops, you can only have one of an item type in a shop.
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10:28 rfrasur RoganH: So if you wanted three diff t-shirts of the same type w/ a diff design, you'd need three shops.  You used to be able to rip the code out and put into whatever webpage, but I'm not sure if you can do that anymore since they rolled out the premium shops.
10:29 rfrasur I dunno about zazzle
10:29 RoganH rfrasur: actually I didn't know that.  At this point I'm leaning more towards Zazzle but need to look at it more too
10:29 rfrasur I think Zazzle may also come out a little cheaper to the customer.
10:30 RoganH That would be good.  I think we can get better margins on them as well.
10:30 RoganH "with them" rather
10:30 rfrasur better_margins++
10:35 gmcharlt rfrasur: without better margins, marginalia is just too cramped
10:36 rfrasur gmcharlt++ #that is Friday truth.
10:43 phasefx if it can't handle pocket labels, we don't want it
10:44 bshum sal_: Out of curiosity, that's Ubuntu 12.04 server edition?
10:44 rfrasur phasefx: for t-shirts?
10:44 senator sal_: are you using these directions, and did you follow step 2 "installing prerequisites", particularly the make -f ... command ?
10:44 phasefx rfrasur: I was intentionally ambiguous there, sorry :)
10:44 senator sal_: http://open-ils.org/documentation/​install/OpenSRF/README_2_2_0.html
10:44 rfrasur phasefx: I like it.  Keep it ambiguous
10:45 phasefx margins made me think of label printing
10:45 rfrasur labels............
10:46 * rfrasur looks for her happy place
10:46 rfrasur on a brighter note, 113 is a prime number :p
10:49 mrpeters is there any way to enable the dom inspector without rebuilding a staff client?
10:50 mrpeters js hack or something in install directory?
10:50 phasefx mrpeters: I think you can load it as an extension, but I haven't tried that in a long time
10:50 mrpeters phasefx: right on, ill look into it
10:50 mrpeters trying to hide a menu option from circulation menu but i can't seem to find the key for some reason
10:50 phasefx using the Extension manager under Admin -> For Developers, and maybe a specially hacked package for the DOM Inspector
10:50 mrpeters right on
10:52 mrpeters happen to know the name of the xul for "Clear Shelf-Expired Holds" off hand?
10:52 mrpeters trying to hide that option from Circulation dropdown menu
10:53 phasefx the entity for it will be in lang.dtd
10:53 rfrasur (Yay! Only 277 more vols to edit)
10:53 mrpeters yeah, tahts where i found it, then i grep for that entitity and can't find a matching xul
10:54 mrpeters been a while since i tinkered with hiding elements like this
10:55 phasefx mrpeters: are you looking in chrome/ ?
10:55 mrpeters i was rgrepping from /openils/var/web
10:55 phasefx yeah, it's not remote xul.  You'll need a new staff client for changes like that
10:56 mrpeters aw snap
10:56 mrpeters well, at least i can push an autoupdate
10:57 mrpeters thanks man
10:57 phasefx though there's some general infrastructure to tying permissions to those menu entries.  I'm just not very familiar with it
10:57 phasefx tsbere would be your man there
10:57 mrpeters yeah, their permissions are a little unstrict....people can do way too much
10:58 mrpeters but if i could find one permission that i revoke from everyone to block that menu that'd be a good solution
10:58 mrpeters ....and now their power just went out or something
10:58 mrpeters server died, phone system is dead
10:58 mrpeters good fun
10:59 rfrasur mrpeters: sounds like a party
10:59 mrpeters everything is bigger in texas!
10:59 rfrasur :-)
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11:06 sal_ bshum: Desktop, I think.  I don't mind doing exploratory apt-gets, but I don't recall this much work on earlier installs.  Of course, it has been a while.
11:06 bshum sal_: Yep, so you'll definitely need server edition to have happier installations.
11:07 sal_ senator: Hmm.  I didn't install Make because that's included.  I'll give that a try.
11:07 bshum The desktop edition misses packages (apparently like the syslog stuff) and that gets weird fast.
11:07 senator sal_: well, it's not installing make i'm worried about. you wouldn't get far without make, it's the make -f command
11:07 bshum I know that we covered it at some developer meeting, but we're still slowly trying to clarify that the server edition is the proper starting point, just because we're not currently supporting the desktop editions.
11:08 senator that installs all the prerequisites for opensrf
11:08 senator including the package that has Unix/Syslog.pm in it
11:08 bshum Of course the downloads page doesn't actually say that on it... *big sigh*
11:08 sal_ senator: Ah.  Okay.  I missed that in the instructions.
11:08 senator also, desktop editions are just that, not for running servers (if that's an issue here)
11:08 senator i mean, you might get away with it
11:08 senator but in general servers don't need GUIs
11:09 sal_ Would it be more helpful for me to install the Make package and see if Desktop is happier, or just give up and install Server.  (Hey, it's a VM, I can blow it away.)
11:09 sal_ And I rather like having a UI :-)
11:10 sal_ Multiple terminals (one for root, one for opensrf, one for {user}) make the install much easier.
11:10 senator you misunderstand me
11:10 senator of course that is all good
11:10 senator you need a UI on your workstation itself
11:10 senator i'm not a masochist!
11:10 senator but the environment where the evergreen server runs doesn't need its own GUI
11:12 senator but that's not really the important issue. yeah, your experience installing opensrf and evergreen will better match the installation instructions if the VM you install onto is ubuntu server edition instead of desktop edition
11:12 sal_ I think y'all are right--I think I left out the prereq install step.  Sigh.  No more caffeine-free installations.
11:18 csharp ~srfsh
11:19 csharp is that "search the opac by keyword via srfsh" spell documented anywhere?
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11:38 senator csharp: not that i can think of, but it's request open-ils.search open-ils.search.biblio.multiclass.query {} "piano limit(10) offset(10)"    if you were looking for it now
11:39 senator i mean, there's the api documentation for that method,
11:39 senator and there's the wiki page about search grammar,
11:39 senator http://evergreen-ils.org/dokuwiki/doku.php​?id=documentation:technical:search_grammar
11:40 berick another example (from activity log for jspac)
11:40 berick request open-ils.search open-ils.search.biblio.multiclass.query {"org_unit":1,"depth":0,"limit":10,"offset":0,"vi​sibility_limit":3000,"default_class":"keyword"}, "concerto", 1
11:41 csharp senator++ berick++ # thanks
11:44 jcamins Ooh, I'd forgot about using filters for limit and offset.
11:44 jcamins senator++ # for the reminder
11:45 senator ftr, tpac  puts more ... stuff... into the second argument (the string one) using filters and such, whereas jspac used a lot of key/value pairs in the first (hash) argument
11:46 jcamins senator: I'm currently moving Biblionarrator onto a QP-based search model.
11:47 jcamins (from one that looked a lot more like jspac)
11:48 senator nice
11:50 jcamins Just getting it to sort of parse took so long that I forgot about all the cool non-atom features that QP has.
11:52 * csharp just added those srfsh commands to http://www.open-ils.org/dokuwiki/doku​.php?id=scratchpad:random_magic_spell​s&amp;#use_srfsh_to_search_the_opac
11:52 csharp ~spells
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11:53 csharp ~spells is <reply> See http://www.evergreen-ils.org/dokuwiki/do​ku.php?id=scratchpad:random_magic_spells for useful Evergreen magic spells.
11:53 pinesol_green I'll remember that, csharp
11:58 csharp ~magicspells is <alias> spells
11:58 pinesol_green I'll remember that, csharp
12:03 phasefx csharp: that did something weird when I tried it with pinesol privately
12:03 phasefx alternating states
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12:04 * phasefx 's chaos powers at work
12:05 rfrasur alternating states /= alternate states
12:07 csharp ~magicspells
12:07 pinesol_green See http://www.evergreen-ils.org/dokuwiki/do​ku.php?id=scratchpad:random_magic_spells for useful Evergreen magic spells.
12:07 csharp phasefx: what did it do?
12:07 phasefx or more specifically, it would spit out the URL _and_ an invalid command response the first time, an invalid command response the second time, and then loop on the two behaviors with each further invocation
12:08 phasefx but of course, now pinesol is ignoring me for 10 minutes for spamming it with invalid commands :)
12:09 csharp yeah - it's got some multiple personality disorder re: the ubottu vs. supybot behavior
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12:24 rfrasur Last 32 volumes.  Not sure whether rejoicing or collapsing is in order.
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12:52 rfrasur shelf lists remind me how much I love weeding
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14:23 berick <- 0822
14:23 rfrasur berick++
14:27 pinesol_green [evergreen|Bill Erickson] LP1182519 Per-Hold Behind Desk Value - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=54bc2ed>
14:27 pinesol_green [evergreen|Bill Erickson] LP#1182519 Stamping DB upgrade 0822 - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=f9a2646>
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14:41 csharp @blame [quote random]
14:41 pinesol_green csharp: Quote #33: "< eeevil> `Twas brillig, and the slithy toves / Did gyre and gimble in pg_locks" (added by csharp at 02:05 PM, October 02, 2012) stole csharp's ice cream!
14:43 kmlussier Huh, that's odd. Why is the quote stealing csharp's ice cream?
14:44 csharp @blame [quote random]
14:44 pinesol_green csharp: Quote #57: "< jeff_> nine million useless rows in money.billing, nine million useless rows... take one down, pass it around, eight million nine-hundred and ninety-nine thousand nine-hundred and ninety nine useless rows in money.billing..." (added by csharp at 03:15 PM, May 23, 2013) broke Evergreen.
14:44 kmlussier Oh, I see.
14:44 rfrasur ohhh, interesting
14:44 bshum Heh
14:45 kmlussier csharp: Thank you,sir, for providing yet another way for us to amuse ourselves in IRC.
14:45 rfrasur indeed
14:45 csharp if we added more plugins, it would be more fun, but then pinesol_green would become zoia
14:48 paxed perhaps some quotes could be printed in small on the conference programming guide, or whatever it's called. :P
14:48 rfrasur Yes..they should.
14:51 rfrasur Steve Wills cracks me up.
14:51 * rfrasur is cracked up.
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14:52 csharp @quote get 44
14:52 pinesol_green csharp: Quote #44: "<bshum> Hmm, maybe it's just me, but your commits seem to be coming from my future." (added by csharp at 06:54 PM, February 20, 2013)
14:52 bshum That still happens.
14:52 kmlussier bshum++
14:52 bshum Drives me crazy
14:53 * csharp loves that quote
14:53 csharp very whovian
14:53 * bshum would buy a mug with that.
14:54 bshum But I'd buy lots of things.
14:54 rfrasur bshum++
14:56 csharp bshum-themed_swag++
14:57 rfrasur lol, now I'm envisioning a t-shirt w/ a picture of bshum holding his quote mug
14:57 kmlussier Oh, we should have a photo or silhouette of the quoter on the swag too!
14:57 bshum Oh, my god.
14:57 rfrasur kmlussier++
14:58 * rfrasur laughs
14:58 kmlussier Like those quotes they put on Facebook, right? bshum could look all serious while talking about commits from his future.
14:58 phasefx that'll be our money maker :)
14:58 senator !
14:58 senator i love this idea
14:59 * senator starts making bshum memes
14:59 rfrasur :D, the moment Friday became a success.
14:59 sal_ someone was muttering about cafepress earlier--does this mean there'll be swag in Boston? :-D
14:59 bshum Ha.
14:59 rfrasur sal_:yep
14:59 bshum You guys are awesome.
15:00 sal_ Sweet.  I want a "SIP" mug for dyrcona ;-)
15:00 csharp sal_++
15:01 csharp "I (heart) MARC" mugs for all the developers
15:01 rfrasur hah! good idea
15:01 bradl time for target practice
15:01 rfrasur csharp: seriously
15:02 rfrasur @blame csharp
15:02 pinesol_green rfrasur: Your failure is now complete, csharp.
15:02 kmlussier sal_: Not necessarily in Boston. I think they're talking about selling them online.
15:02 csharp ha!
15:02 csharp pinesol_green++
15:02 rfrasur hehe
15:02 rfrasur y'all are far more interesting that staff scheduling.
15:03 phasefx "I (heart) MARC" shot glass?
15:03 sal_ or beer mugs...
15:03 rfrasur phasefx: sal_: that's closer
15:03 phasefx steins
15:03 csharp phasefx++
15:04 phasefx apparently there is a Marc Stein for ESPN
15:04 csharp @google marc stein
15:04 pinesol_green csharp: Go away, or I'll replace you with a very small shell script!
15:04 csharp bleh
15:04 rfrasur phasefx++ #Marc Stein.  Little does he know
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15:49 dbwells I'm a bit late, but last call (from me) for anyone wanting something reviewed for alpha2.
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15:55 hopkinsju Is there something that needs to be done when switching from OpenLibrary to Syndetics for added content?
15:56 * paxed sort-of feels like alpha1/2 didn't get enough commit love... but perhaps that's just because most of my fixes didn't get in yet.
15:59 eeevil paxed: luckily for you (and thankfully for us all) most of yours are bug fixes, and can go in during beta
15:59 paxed eeevil: i don't think i know the Eg code well enough yet to do anything more.
16:02 paxed "i'll change this ... why is <that other code> breaking?"
16:02 paxed but now, some sleep.
16:11 * hopkinsju facepalms - didn't notce that the base_url element was commented...
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16:48 dbwells berick: I'm reviewing bug #1207396, and I've got some questions about it if you are still around.
16:48 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1207396 in Evergreen "Patron self-registration form" (affected: 1, heat: 6) [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1207396 - Assigned to Dan Wells (dbw2)
16:57 berick dbwells: i am
16:58 dbwells berick: cool.  First question, does self-registration already exist in some form?   It seems like this is modifying some stuff which has existed for a long time, but I can't recall ever seeing it.
16:58 dbwells and can't find it now.
17:01 berick dbwells: only the staff pieces and the API existed
17:01 berick there never was a UI for patrons to use
17:02 berick this work fills in the gaps
17:08 dbwells berick: okay, that's what it seemed like from searching around.  So my second question is less relevent in light of that, but you added an event to stage.create for detecting username collisions, then the WWW side also checks for collisions (i.e. that event never happens).  If nothing else uses this API, it doesn't really matter.  So, I guess there is no question, unless you expected that event to happen somewhere :)
17:09 berick nah, just belt+suspenders
17:09 berick others may use the API
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17:09 dbwells right, no problem
17:09 berick dbwells++ # testing
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19:04 hbrennan Anyone know if HTML can be used in the emailed courtesy notice template? I would rather stick an <a> tag instead of displaying a link to our catalog....
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19:19 hbrennan Oh darn. Why does it have to be so early in Alaska?
19:27 dbwells grabbing 0823
19:37 pinesol_green Showing latest 5 of 9 commits to Evergreen...
19:37 pinesol_green [evergreen|Bill Erickson] LP1207396 TPAC org_selector supports org filter - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=a14e0b4>
19:37 pinesol_green [evergreen|Bill Erickson] LP1207396 pending patron reg show requestor - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=5981733>
19:37 pinesol_green [evergreen|Bill Erickson] LP1207396 Patron Self-Register Release Notes - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=cb2ad9d>
19:38 pinesol_green [evergreen|Dan Wells] Trivial changes - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=7df7e93>
19:38 pinesol_green [evergreen|Dan Wells] Stamping upgrade for patron self-reg - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=3613e27>
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