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IRC log for #evergreen, 2013-06-20

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Time Nick Message
00:00 paxed hmm... now how do i change the contents of a marc field via sql?
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07:18 paxed @roulette
07:18 pinesol_green paxed: *click*
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07:51 csharp paxed: to change a marc field, you probably need regexp_replace()
07:52 dbs might be safer to write a pl/perl function that uses MARC::Record / MARC::File::XML
07:53 csharp dbs: ooh - good idea
07:54 * dbs has done that a few times but plans to write it up for the postgresql w/ evergreen tutorial
08:10 paxed dbs: got an example code you could show?
08:13 paxed we've got classification numbers (similar to Dewey) in 084a. The search normalization cuts words at full stop, but that makes it impossible to search by those classification numbers in expert search. this seems to be true of dewey too...
08:14 paxed how would i make the 084a use a different normalization/no normalization/whatever?
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08:21 pastebot "dbs" at 204.193.129.146 pasted "plperl function body - needs to be wrapped in CREATE OR REPLACE FUNCTION blah() AS ..." (100 lines) at http://paste.evergreen-ils.org/19
08:22 dbs paxed: just grabbed that from our production database, ran it around 1.5 years ago, don't have the CREATE FUNCTION statement ready at hand
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10:04 krvmga take a look at this search, please http://bark.cwmars.org/eg/opac/results?que​ry=King%2C+Stephen&fg%3Aformat_filters​=6&qtype=author&locg=103&sort=
10:04 krvmga this is a search, limited to a particular library scope, for King, Stephen
10:05 krvmga does anyone have any insight on why the search order is like this?
10:06 kmlussier Added author is Stephen Michael King
10:06 * tsbere was just about to say that
10:07 kmlussier krvmga: I know in the past you talked about adding an index just for the 100 field to add weight to the primary author for author searches. I imagine that would address this issue.
10:07 dbs illustrated by Stephen Michael King as well as added author Stephen Michael King
10:07 kmlussier It's the same issue as the Emily Dickinson issue that came up a few weeks ago.
10:07 dbs two hits in the same record
10:07 kmlussier dbs++ #I missed that
10:07 dbs therefore the relevancy is thought to be very high
10:10 krvmga dbs: yes, that's what i suspected. that the more times the terms appear in a record, the more "relevant" it is assumed to be.
10:10 kmlussier Hmmm...it would help if https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1174860 were fixed. Then you would get results when clicking on Stephen King personal author facet.
10:10 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1174860 in Evergreen "tpac: search filter groups don't play nicely with facets" (affected: 2, heat: 12) [Undecided,Triaged]
10:17 krvmga when i look at the results for the search i linked, the 7th result is the book "Joyland" by Stephen King. The terms Stephen and King appear twice in this record. They also appear twice in every record above this record. What causes the order of returns?
10:19 dbs way more text in the record
10:19 dbs therefore the # of matches :: text length is a lower ratio than for the higher-ranked results
10:19 dbs 4/100 < 4/25
10:22 kmlussier krvmga: At one time, we adjusted some of the relevance settings on the C/W MARS server so that the smaller records wouldn't appear above larger records. However, the relevance ranking was even worse, so I don't recommend playing with those anymore.
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10:28 krvmga dbs: i'm not sure that the text in the record thought holds water. the first and the fourth returns have less text that the sixth return.
10:28 csharp btw, if there is a "intro to evergreen hacking" in the works, I'd love to be a test dummy for that project ;-)
10:29 krvmga csharp: is there such a thing? because i'd be all 'me, too' on that.
10:30 csharp krvmga: someone ( Dyrcona? ) mentioned it as an "it would be nice if..." type thing
10:31 Dyrcona Yeah, that was me. I think kivilahtio's work on debugging could be cleaned up into a nice chapter.
10:31 * Dyrcona goes back to digging into internal server errors as a nice distraction from his "report on reports."
10:32 kmlussier I came across an asciidoc questions while working on docs yesterday. Paragraph 2 of http://docs.evergreen-ils.org/2.4/_vand​elay_integration_into_acquisitions.html refers to two other chapters in the documentation. I wanted to add a link there rather than directing people to older docs.
10:32 kmlussier It was fairly easy to add a releative link to the html version of the chapter, but since we generate the docs in pdf and epub, is there another way I should be linking to them? Something that is format agnostic?
10:36 csharp kmlussier: I believe link:/path/to/chapter does it? (I may be wrong
10:36 csharp )
10:37 csharp I was able to generate a manual with images in a separate dir, so I'm assuming relative links work the same way?
10:38 csharp my source: https://github.com/gpls-dev/PINES-Documentation
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10:50 kmlussier csharp: Thanks! I'll look at it.
10:59 dbs krvmga: it's not purely about text length; it's a ratio. cover density plays into it too. I'm not sure what your point is about 1st, 4th, and 6th hits, but if you doubt me, ts_rank_cd() is written up here http://www.postgresql.org/docs/9.3/static/t​extsearch-controls.html#TEXTSEARCH-RANKING and the original paper on cover density (which complements TF/IDF ranking) is at http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/vie​wdoc/summary?doi=10.1.1.12.1615
11:00 krvmga dbs: :)
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11:05 dbs "For more information, see the included tech spec documents.
11:05 dbs " -- from the release notes, those would ideally be linked and embedded I guess
11:08 * csharp prints out the cover density article
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11:09 csharp since my eyes glaze over at mention of that term, I suppose it's time to learn what it actually is ;-)
11:09 rfrasur csharp: cover density?
11:09 * rfrasur thinks that it has something to do with thread count
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11:11 dbs heh, I see link:../installation/edi_setup.txt[Setting Up EDI Acquisitions] doesn't work too well in PDF
11:12 dbs kmlussier: I think you want <<id,caption>>
11:13 dbs circulation/circulating_items.txt has a good example
11:13 kmlussier dbs: OK, I saw that when I was searching through the asciidoc docs yesterday. I'll return to those and see if I can make sense of it.
11:14 dbs basically, you define your target ID in any file using [[thisismyid]]
11:14 dbs then you can link to it using "See the section on <<thisismyid,Creating new status messages>>" from anywhere else
11:14 dbs It does the right thing in HTML, PDF, and ePub
11:15 kmlussier dbs++
11:15 kmlussier That's just what I needed. Thanks!
11:19 dbs mmm, post-upgrade fun, now hitting many more "need more child processes" errors :/
11:20 berick kmlussier: your sign-off link at the bottom of bug 1179609 should be user/kmlussier/acq-order-ident-apply-inline, correct?  (instead of the /berick/ branch linked)
11:20 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 1179609 in Evergreen "PO 'Apply Order Identifiers' action easy to miss" (affected: 2, heat: 10) [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1179609
11:21 * berick thinks that looks right
11:23 kmlussier berick: Oops! Yes, sorry about that.
11:23 berick no prob
11:26 pinesol_green [evergreen|Bill Erickson] LP1179609 ACQ lineitem identifier inline update - <http://git.evergreen-ils.org/?p=​Evergreen.git;a=commit;h=adba9bf>
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11:33 Dyrcona Yay! Another branch gone from my integration list!
11:34 bshum Yay indeed!
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11:47 * rfrasur is enlisting eldest son on the Spanish translation (starting w/ tpac)
11:47 bshum rfrasur++
11:48 rfrasur they owe me, right? (okay...recognizing that that's not EXACTLY how parenting works)
11:48 bshum rfrasur: There might be some strings of interest in the old jspac translation files too.
11:48 bshum That could be portable.
11:48 bshum That was something I was thinking to try since one of Bibliomation's libs helped contribute the Spanish JSPAC file.
11:48 bshum But we haven't had time to work on the TPAC one
11:48 rfrasur okay, we'll pick through it this weekend.
11:49 bshum In case it helps (or not)
11:49 rfrasur well, it def wouldn't hurt
11:49 * rfrasur also has a son learning Korean.  We have any interested libs on the peninsula?
11:50 dbs rfrasur++
11:51 rfrasur (so far, he can write his name and say "I love you."...valuable translation skills)
11:55 rfrasur bshum: can you point me in the right direction or the jspac?
11:56 bshum Launchpad is being unhappy with me right now.
11:57 bshum But I think it was opac.dtd
11:57 rfrasur I might have found it...oh, I didn't then.  I have opac.js
11:58 rfrasur (it was in the same list...and I found it...because yeah...that's how smart I am)
11:58 rfrasur @praise rfrasur
11:58 * pinesol_green rfrasur can run a report without assistance
11:58 rfrasur it's true
12:03 dbs [WARN:8405:Server.pm:166:] server: no children available, waiting... consider increasing max_children for this application higher than 15 in the OpenSRF configuration if this message occurs frequently
12:04 dbs Damn it would be nice if it said _which_ server :)
12:04 bshum o.O
12:04 bshum Indeed...
12:05 paxed re. the hypothetical intro to hacking, that dbs slideshow about tpac hacking could be another chapter, with some minor modifications.
12:05 rfrasur paxed++
12:05 rfrasur dbs++
12:05 dbs Trying to figure out what is suddenly causing these shortages of children after running along nicely for 2.3...
12:06 rfrasur puberty
12:06 dbs hah
12:06 paxed child labor laws.
12:06 berick dbs: it should say in the log, right before that message
12:06 rfrasur paxed++ #and that
12:06 berick the name of the service should be part of every log message
12:07 dbs berick: yeah, I'm just looking at osrfwarn.log right now, but cross-referencing with the full logs would be nice to avoid at a glance
12:07 berick the content of the warn log should be identical to the osrfsys log
12:07 berick warn == cat osrfsys | grep WARN (effectively)
12:08 dbs berick: I understand that
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12:09 * rfrasur has an office overrun with girl children.  The children are here.
12:09 dbs I also agree that the name of the service should be part of every log message
12:09 dbs Here's my nice, full message: 2013-06-20 11:05:15 protostar [WARN:16124:Server.pm:166:] server: no children available, waiting... consider increasing max_children for this application higher than 20 in the OpenSRF configuration if this message occurs frequently
12:09 berick wth
12:10 * dbs agrees :)
12:11 dbs after that, of course, there's 2013-06-20 11:08:10 protostar [ERR :3691:EX.pm:66:1371444515357165] Exception: OpenSRF::EX::Session 2013-06-20T11:08:10 OpenSRF::Transport /usr/local/share/perl/5.10​.1/OpenSRF/Transport.pm:83 Session Error: opensrf@private.opensrf.conifer/open-ils.search​_drone_at_protostar.cs.uoguelph.ca_3696 IS NOT CONNECTED TO THE NETWORK!!!
12:11 dbs So I can figure out the services (plural, sadly) that are dying
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12:16 berick grep :16124: osrfsys.log | head would (hopefully) show the troubled service at a glance
12:16 berick looked at the osrf code, and i can't see how the service isn't getting logged, so odd
12:17 berick the first thing each Listener does is set the logger servic name
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12:48 rfrasur I am confident that the state of Indiana is conspiring to steal years of my life.
12:48 Rogan It's not much of a secret conspiracy.  There's a memo. Did you get it?
12:49 rfrasur No...I suspect it went to my spam folder.
12:49 bshum @hate zimbra
12:49 pinesol_green bshum: The operation succeeded.  bshum hates zimbra.
12:49 Rogan Well, I'm glad to see I'm not the only one having one of those days.
12:51 * rfrasur deletes expletive and steps away from the [off] button
12:53 rfrasur @hate State of Indiana Department of Workforce Development online interface
12:53 pinesol_green rfrasur: The operation succeeded.  rfrasur hates State of Indiana Department of Workforce Development online interface.
12:54 rfrasur @hate stupid state bureaucracy
12:54 pinesol_green rfrasur: The operation succeeded.  rfrasur hates stupid state bureaucracy.
13:00 rfrasur FINALLY!  Stupid thing.
13:00 * rfrasur just wants to file a stinkin' report.  That's all.
13:00 rfrasur @librarian
13:00 pinesol_green rfrasur: Management:8, Cataloging:9, Acquisitions:6, Reference:7, Circulation:13, Systems:11, Research:10, Custodial:14
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13:10 rfrasur At least they have a toll-free service number
13:12 rfrasur (so I can talk w/ the person whose cell phone is going off in the background)
13:24 jihpringle could someone explain the difference between a staff login and a permanent login in 2.4 (Admin->Operator Change: New)?
13:24 jihpringle I've done both and as far as the staff client is concerned I don't see any difference
13:25 kmlussier jihpringle: I think the permanent login logs out the previous user. The staff login does not, so you can switch back. But tsbere should be able to confirm this.
13:25 bshum Sounds right to me.
13:26 bshum Oh hmm
13:26 bshum If I were guessing
13:26 tsbere permanent is "you can't go back to the previous user, and operator change remains at 'new' when you are done". Everything else lets you use operator change to go back to the user you were before.
13:26 bshum Yeah
13:26 tsbere Or, to go another route: "Staff" gives you a red bar. "Permanent" doesn't. ;)
13:27 bshum So is staff login basically just a longer operator change than the temporary which expires after a few minutes?
13:27 jihpringle that makes sense, thank you
13:27 tsbere bshum: Well, that will depend. If you made your "temporary" logins as long as staff ones they won't appear to be different. ;)
13:27 tsbere That largely falls into login type defs, though
13:27 bshum Heh
13:27 bshum Gotcha.
13:27 jihpringle i think part of the problem was in earlier versions of our testing server I wasn't getting the red bar for staff but I do now
13:28 jihpringle thanks all
13:36 * rfrasur has conquered the state system and reported and needs chocolate.
13:37 rfrasur @love chocolate
13:37 pinesol_green rfrasur: The operation succeeded.  rfrasur loves chocolate.
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13:51 gmcharlt 10-minute warning for the EOB meeting
13:51 * bshum gathers popcorn
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13:51 bshum On the edge of my seat gmcharlt!
13:52 * StephenGWills cranks the air raid sireen
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13:52 kmlussier bshum: to throw at the EOB members?
13:52 StephenGWills note to self: get that ring tone
13:53 rfrasur hmm, that'd be a pretty awesome ringtone for a day or two.
13:53 kmlussier StephenGWills: It certainly would get everyone's attention.
13:54 StephenGWills nutting beats my Nichelle saying "Message from Starfleet, Captain" :)
13:54 * phasefx keeps reading EOB as End of Board
13:56 StephenGWills EOB == End of Bandwidth :(
13:56 gmcharlt Era Of Bugfixes
14:00 gmcharlt OK, showtime
14:00 gmcharlt #startmeeting Evergreen Oversight Board meeting, 20 June 2013
14:00 pinesol_green Meeting started Thu Jun 20 14:00:52 2013 US/Eastern.  The chair is gmcharlt. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:00 pinesol_green Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
14:00 pinesol_green The meeting name has been set to 'evergreen_oversight_board_meeting__20_june_2013'
14:00 StephenGWills Early Onset Befuddlement?
14:01 gmcharlt #info Agenda can be found at http://evergreen-ils.org/dokuwiki/dok​u.php?id=governance:minutes:2013-6-20
14:01 rfrasur StephenGWills++
14:01 gmcharlt #topic Board member role-call; please use #info to identify yourselves
14:01 StephenGWills ls
14:01 gmcharlt #info gmcharlt = Galen Charlton, ESI
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14:01 kmlussier #info kmlussier is Kathy Lussier, MassLNC
14:01 Rogan #info Rogan = Rogan Hamby, SCLENDS
14:01 dbwells #info dbwells = Dan Wells, Hekman Library (Calvin College)
14:01 sborger #info sborger = Shauna Borger, Indiana State Library
14:02 yboston #info yboston is Yamil Suarez - Berklee College of Music
14:02 abneiman #info abneiman is Andrea Buntz Neiman, Kent County Public Library
14:02 StephenGWills #info StephenGWills - Maine Balsam Consortium
14:02 montgoc1 #info montgoc1 = Chauncey Montgomery, Consortium of Ohio Libraries
14:02 rfrasur #info rfrasur Ruth Frasur, Evergreen Indiana (Hagerstown Library)
14:04 gmcharlt thanks; we have a quorum of EOB members; also, since Dan Wells is here, I'll add an agenda item for him to give a Release Manager update
14:04 gmcharlt moving on
14:04 gmcharlt #topic Financial report
14:04 gmcharlt #info Galen has a pending request to update SSH keys to get access to it; will submit to mailing list when ready
14:05 gmcharlt not much to say until I send the details, other than that it's my understanding that all pending financial matters from the 2013 conference are closed
14:05 gmcharlt #topic Evergreen 2014 Conference Committee Report
14:06 gmcharlt kmlussier: anything to report?
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14:06 kmlussier #info we are finalizing our sponsorship categories and will be sending a sponsorship package to the SFC soon for approval. Hopefully, we'll have something in time for ALA so that we can start talking to potential sponsors there.
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14:07 kmlussier #info The programming committee has been considering alternate schedules for this year's conference and will be sending them out to get feedback from the greater community sometime soon.
14:07 elfsts Elfstrand joining sorry I'm late
14:07 kmlussier #info Still waiting on the final contract.
14:08 kmlussier That's all I have for now.
14:08 gmcharlt kmlussier++ # thanks
14:08 gmcharlt any questions?
14:08 montgoc1 Curious about alternate schedules?
14:09 abneiman Also curious about this.
14:09 montgoc1 Is that just how the sessions are laid out?
14:09 kmlussier montgoc1: Sure, we've been looking at different ways to handle the hackfest days and the final day.
14:09 kmlussier And we've also been thinking about the possibility of building longer tutorials into the schedule.
14:10 montgoc1 Nice.
14:10 Rogan We're looking at doing a regional Evergreen conference and have had very similar thoughts.
14:10 kmlussier As an example, one of the potential schedules would have tutorials happening at the same time as the hackfest, and the interest group meetings happening alongside other programming.
14:10 kmlussier And there's been interest in having a full-day doc hackfest at the same time as the developer hackfest.
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14:11 kmlussier Here are some of the sample schedules I pulled together, but it still a work in progress. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ar​4gDMUDwDXqdHBOZExuVVVBdUZEQ2Nob2VPLWVQU1E#gid=0
14:12 gmcharlt kmlussier: thanks
14:12 gmcharlt moving on
14:12 gmcharlt #topic Potential policy for adding support companies to Evergreen website
14:12 abneiman Thanks Kathy!  I really like the idea of having tutorials on hackfest day.
14:13 gmcharlt #info Discussion points are at http://list.evergreen-ils.org/pipermail/​eg-oversight-board/2013-June/000502.html
14:13 gmcharlt #info Koha's policy is at http://koha-community.org/support​/paid-support/how-to-get-listed/
14:13 Rogan Kathy, are you imagining something pretty close to the Koha one?
14:14 Polo I need to wipe my usr table, I actually need to wipe alot of things but I want to keep my bib records. We have about 80k records of patrons that were entered in incorrectly.
14:14 kmlussier Rogan: I think it makes a good starting point, but we might want to adapt some  things.
14:14 kmlussier Rogan: What are your thoughts on the Koha policy? Anything you like or don't like about it?
14:15 Rogan Pros: Very general, very simple, very non-judgemental.
14:15 Rogan Cons: Not much in the way of definition so value is there but some might see it as pretty limited.
14:15 kmlussier Rogan: Yes, I think it's important that it be non-judgemental. My concern is that we define what Evergreen services are. I just think there may be some vendors on our list that really don't provide Evergreen services.
14:16 yboston Polo:  right now we are having a meeting of the Evergreen board on this IRC channel. Do you mind asking your question in about an hour?
14:16 kmlussier But it's hard to take them off the web site when we don't have any guidelines or policy in place.
14:16 emckinney We will need a very specific definition of services.
14:17 montgoc1 I agree that services need defined well.
14:17 kmlussier In some cases, the vendors don't even mention Evergreen on their web sites.
14:17 Rogan And services could be pretty broad.  Is writing an RFP an evergreen service when you help to write sole source letters because you have Evergreen experience?  Some would say yes and some no.
14:17 elfsts in the form why not have a list of services? Hosting, Training, Development, Migration, List of Evergreen Customers and links to their Evergreen Sites
14:18 emckinney What about all those peripheral device add-ons...3m and such
14:18 yboston We could start simple with our definition of services, while publicly reserving the right to make it more specific in the future.
14:18 kmlussier emckinney: I don't think peripheral devices belong there. That's not an Evergreen service. That's something that works with Evergreen.
14:18 Rogan I don't object to a list of defined services in principle but I am concerned about it being inclusive enough without being so vague as to go off the rails.
14:19 Rogan kmlussier: but what if a peripheral needs special setup with evergreen, like sorters
14:19 Rogan there is specialized knowledge and implementation experience with Evergreen
14:19 StephenGWills So, if we are not endorsing anyone, why put much work into helping them define their businesses?  Why not just provide a virtual cork board and let people pin their business card to it?  Word of mouth will do the rest won't it?
14:19 emckinney PINES asks 3rd party vendors to develop their own links to Evergreen.  3m and a few others have developed the crosswalks for our libraries.  I'm not insisting...just informing.
14:20 * gmcharlt notes that the Koha paid-support list does *not* list services; it just lists contact information
14:20 emckinney and the virtual corkboard becomes useless when you have to wade through those who do/do not provide actual services.
14:22 rfrasur Maybe a moderated cork board?
14:22 montgoc1 If there were some broad service categories, that could perhaps help potential clients narrow the list down to those companies that best meet their needs.
14:22 kmlussier My thought is if everyone (or most of us) think it's a good idea to have some guidelines, then maybe a small group of us can work on it. It might also be good to get feedback from the vendor community.
14:22 emckinney How did we define who becomes a member of the Evergreen community?  Perhaps we could use something from that to be consistent. Looking now for the Oversight Board Rules of Governance.
14:22 yboston emckinney++
14:23 Rogan I'm ok with some guidelines but as is often the case the devil is in the details.  I worry about them being too narrow.
14:24 kmlussier Rogan: That's why I liked the Koha guidelines. It's very broad.
14:24 Rogan And when we start defining members of the community ... it's a sticky wicket.
14:24 kmlussier gmcharlt: Any idea on how well these guidelines work (or don't work) for Koha?
14:24 StephenGWills the nice thing about a virtual cork board is that it can support tagging which allows one to search the contacts by those keywords, maybe?
14:25 Rogan I like the Koha guidelines.
14:25 kmlussier We have such a small list of vendors. Tagging might be more useful once the community grows.
14:25 gmcharlt kmlussier: there is some history that has influenced the policy, which I won't go into here, but suffice it to say I think the Koha community finds real value in the requirement that listers link back to the website
14:25 Rogan Very broad, allow self identification.
14:26 montgoc1 StephenGWills: I think that would work.
14:26 Rogan I don't mind some services guidelines but I'd still want some chance for the entity to define their own services.  200 word limit?  - not a specific request, just brainstorming
14:28 kmlussier A self-description certainly might be more useful to the user consulting this list.
14:28 abneiman I'm definitely in favor of the link-back to the project.
14:28 gmcharlt OK, is it fair to say that there's a general consensus that some sort of policy should be considered?  and if so, that there are folks willing to hash it out (e.g., on the EOB and other community mailing lists)?
14:28 Rogan I think this should be on the community mailing list ++
14:28 kmlussier +1
14:28 emckinney The verbiage from Rules of Gov was taken out.  I propose we go with something along the lines of "This list is intended to assist members of the community to find Evergreen service providers..."
14:29 emckinney +1 on that...send it to the community mailing list.
14:29 kmlussier gmcharlt: I volunteer.
14:29 Rogan I second Kathy volunteering.  :)
14:29 emckinney But will the webmasters really review? Should it be community policed?
14:30 gmcharlt kmlussier: sounds good.  Are you OK with an action item for you to report back at the next EOB meeting?
14:30 kmlussier Yup
14:30 Rogan We've talked about how we need more eyes on the web site, it could be a special group of volunteers, one or two.
14:30 kmlussier Anyone else want to hash this out with me?
14:30 Rogan I'll chat with you about it but I think the discussion should be open.
14:30 gmcharlt emckinney: since requests must be made to the Koha mailing list, that's were community review takes place; the Koha webmaster essentially just serves a secretarial role
14:31 Rogan I'll promise to help prompt people once you get the ball going and share my opinion.
14:31 rfrasur I'd be glad to help with the understanding that my know how is very limited.
14:31 kmlussier Rogan: Works for me.
14:31 StephenGWills Kathy, happy to chat as well.
14:32 gmcharlt #action kmlussier to kick off broader discussion of the support company listing policy and report back to the EOB at the July meeting
14:32 emckinney Kathy, one favor request.  Could you let us know when you post this to community?
14:33 kmlussier Sure. It probably won't happen until after ALA and my subsequent vacation.
14:33 gmcharlt kmlussier: would you prefer to report back during the August meeting, then?
14:34 kmlussier No, that gives a couple of weeks for discussion. I should have something to report.
14:34 gmcharlt OK
14:34 gmcharlt moving on
14:34 gmcharlt #topic Announcement: Conference call for discussing organizing testing efforts
14:35 gmcharlt sborger: you have the floor
14:35 sborger Rogan, Andrea and I are planning a conference call on July 2 to further discuss organizing test efforts.
14:35 sborger I figured that I had some very basic questions about where to get started and how to get my local staff involved so others probably do as well.
14:35 sborger We will come up with a plan and share it at the next board meeting.
14:36 gmcharlt #info Shauna, Rogan, and Andrea are planning a conference call on July 2 to further discuss organizing test efforts.
14:36 gmcharlt any questions for sborger?
14:36 sborger Let me know if you are interested in joining the conference call right away and keep in mind that we will most likely look for volunteers in the future as well.
14:37 Rogan And the goal is to expand involvement so some of it may seem simple but anything that furthers the community through engagement and the work is worthy I think.
14:38 montgoc1 What time on July 2?
14:38 rfrasur I PMed this to Shauna, but then thought it should be asked in open.  Will the conference call be using actual phones or an online interface?
14:38 Rogan 2 PM EST
14:39 gmcharlt #info Please contact Shauna if you're interested in joining the conference call
14:40 gmcharlt ok, thanks sborger!
14:40 gmcharlt #topic Release manager update
14:40 gmcharlt dbwells: you have the floor
14:40 dbwells Thanks.  Nothing especially new to report, but I can recap what has happened so far.
14:41 dbwells #info We had to extend the deadline by a few days, but we did meet our goal of cutting open pull-requests for 2.5 in half (from 63 to 31) for the first 'm1' milestone.
14:41 dbwells #info Late last week we did the planned whitespace clean-up.  Rather than follow my original plan of doing it in phases, we did it all at once.  So far it appears to have gone without issue, but we should now consider doing the same for older branches to potentially relieve backport pain.
14:41 dbwells #info The next commit push ('m2') is planned for 7/2-7/12.  So far it is looking like the to-do pile will be smaller than for m1 (which is what we would hope for).  One thing I am learning is that it is generally tough to find good rally points during the summer, but several people did comment that having these deadlines was helpful, so I am hopeful we can keep things moving.
14:42 dbwells That is all.
14:42 gmcharlt dbwells++
14:42 gmcharlt any questions for hinm?
14:42 Rogan More of a comment: great job.
14:42 kmlussier Just a general comment. I've been very pleased with teh amount of communication with this release. Thanks Dan!
14:42 kmlussier dbwells++
14:42 yboston I just wanted to say thanks for trying out a new approach, not that the older approaches were bad
14:43 dbwells Thanks, all.  So far so good, but the only real test will be the actual release :)
14:43 gmcharlt thanks, again
14:43 gmcharlt moving on
14:43 gmcharlt #topic Grants and fundraising
14:44 gmcharlt #info Discussion points are at http://list.evergreen-ils.org/pipermail/​eg-oversight-board/2013-June/000501.html
14:44 Rogan Any comments or questions on the discussion points?
14:45 Rogan To me the first goal would be soliciting feedback from the FSC.
14:46 Rogan Though we may want to have an idea of a goal before we talk to them so that we have something in broad strokes.
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14:46 Rogan And it was pointed out that my fingers mangled up the letters so read that as Conservancy :)
14:46 kmlussier Rogan: I agree that contact with the SFC is a good first step. They may also have some general information on how other projects have done this.
14:47 gmcharlt Rogan: I can formally initiate the discussion with Bradley
14:48 * bkuhn is here (awoken by mention of his name) if you need any informal information now.
14:48 Rogan Are there any questions or comments about potential projects?  About potentially building off Loblolly?
14:48 * bkuhn reads backlog
14:49 kmlussier Rogan: I've long been interested in an IdeaTorrent-like site for the community. However, hosting a similar site for my own project, I've found it's good for generating ideas for smaller projects, but isn't as useful in making strategic decisions.
14:50 kmlussier And, as the EOB,  I think we really need to focus on long-term, strategic development.
14:50 Rogan kmlussier: That's a good observation.
14:50 kmlussier But it may be different on a community-wide scale.
14:50 * kmlussier isn't familiar with Loblolly.
14:51 Rogan I just worry about leaving out the community.
14:51 gmcharlt kmlussier: Rogan: is it fair to assume that the likes of IMLS and Mellon tend to prefer funding large, "splashy" projects as opposed to incremental ones?
14:51 Rogan Loblolly was the result of an IMLS planning grant awarded to .... GPLS if I remember correctly.
14:51 bkuhn Rogan: I just read the email you linked to.  Yes, Conservancy would be the right venue (per the FSA) for such things.  (Mozilla is a tough place to get funds from (we've gotten some funding, but wasn't easy and they generally only give targeted to things that directly impact Mozilla itself).  My best advice is for EOB to come up with a specific plan for work to be funded, and then Conservancy can help you hone that and pitch it ar
14:51 bkuhn You all probably know places that are likely to give grants for ILS's better than Conservancy does, though.
14:51 Rogan I would say that's fair Galen.
14:51 kmlussier Oh, I agree. The community definitely needs to have a strong voice in this.
14:52 bkuhn I can follow up with gmcharlt after the meeting.
14:52 * bkuhn reidles.
14:52 * kmlussier has Google loblolly and still can't find anything.
14:53 Rogan Loblolly brought in folks from talking book services programs all over the country.
14:53 Rogan I attended and we discussed ADA needs and tbs needs in open source ilses.
14:53 kmlussier Like focus groups?
14:54 kmlussier I wonder if holding several small focus group-like sessions via Google Hangouts might be effective.
14:54 Rogan Yep.  And input.  The grant was a fairly big one and some of the information was really useful in terms of putting some ADA needs and rural library stuff under the microscope.
14:54 Rogan I think big grant givers would be interested in those needs.
14:55 Rogan And we discussed Evergreen as a vehicle for that.  The rep from IMLS was very interested because they invest a lot in running a minimal TBS ILS every year.
14:56 Rogan For TBS services with no resources.  Evergreen with added functions would be far more robust.
14:56 Rogan And those functions would be awesome for home bound in public libraries.
14:57 gmcharlt cool
14:57 gmcharlt thus far, we have one action item
14:58 gmcharlt #action gmcharlt will formally contact Conservancy to kick off a discussion of grantwriting ideas
14:58 gmcharlt any quick questions for Rogan, as we're near the hour mark
14:58 Rogan Well, if there's no objection I will work with some of the other loblolly participants who are in the Evergreen community
14:58 kmlussier No questions, but maybe we can carry the discussion of how to identify development projects to the list.
14:59 gmcharlt kmlussier: +1
14:59 Rogan and look at writing up those ideas so that we can share it and all be on the same page.
15:00 gmcharlt great
15:00 gmcharlt so...
15:00 gmcharlt #topic Next meeting
15:00 gmcharlt #info Next meeting is scheduled for Thursday, 18 July 2013 at 2 p.m. EDT
15:00 gmcharlt (at which point hopefully those of us going to ALA will have recovered)
15:01 gmcharlt thanks, everybody!
15:01 gmcharlt #endmeeting
15:01 pinesol_green Meeting ended Thu Jun 20 15:01:06 2013 US/Eastern.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
15:01 pinesol_green Minutes:        http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2013/evergreen.2013-06-20-14.00.html
15:01 pinesol_green Minutes (text): http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergr​een/2013/evergreen.2013-06-20-14.00.txt
15:01 pinesol_green Log:            http://evergreen-ils.org/meetings/evergree​n/2013/evergreen.2013-06-20-14.00.log.html
15:01 kmlussier Good meeting everyone!
15:01 kmlussier gmcharlt++
15:01 rfrasur gmcharlt++
15:01 StephenGWills hear, hear!
15:01 yboston gmcharlt++
15:02 kmlussier yboston: In your project to upgrade docs, did you intern do anything with receipts or is that up for grabs?
15:02 kmlussier s/you/your
15:02 yboston it should be up for grabs
15:02 kmlussier yboston: OK thanks!
15:03 * kmlussier grabs it.
15:08 dbs kmlussier++
15:18 Polo I need to wipe my usr table, I actually need to wipe alot of things but I want to keep my bib records. We have about 80k records of patrons that were entered in incorrectly.
15:22 Rogan can you keep a super user and just assign created and edited attributions to them?
15:22 Rogan if you're wiping usr expect to wipe a lot of things that connect to it
15:22 gmcharlt Polo: here is an SQL script you could use
15:22 gmcharlt http://git.esilibrary.com/?p=migration-tools.gi​t;a=blob;f=sql/nuke-patrons-and-circs.sql;h=ba4​dc406500bea8b8857577432c958f488737c16;hb=HEAD
15:23 gmcharlt note that as the name implies, it is also meant to remove any circulation and billings attached to the patrons
15:23 gmcharlt and note that lines 31 and 32 will almost certainly need to be customzed
15:23 Rogan That's the nice way if it's selective.  Can you identify which records to toss or is just kind of a "we've learned from this and want to start over" kind of thing.
15:24 Polo I only really want to keep our Bib records. and the general config of EG. removing all patrons and usrs as well as billings is okay right now.
15:24 gmcharlt if nothing else, you'll want to keep the default administrator account, which typically has actor.usr.id set to 1, as the bibs records are usually linked to it
15:24 Polo Im on a Clone. trying to fix a script that was run on the actor.usr and actor.card tables that was incorrect.
15:25 Polo they are, thats correct
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15:43 hopkinsju When searching in the staff client I'm seeing records without items - ebooks with located uri's are showing in search results despite limiting the search to another org unit. Can anyone else reproduce this?
15:44 hopkinsju Seems like a bug to me...
15:44 hopkinsju I'm running 2.3.3 (yes, still)
15:45 rfrasur (we're on 2.2...so...yeah)
15:45 hopkinsju Yeah, found it. It's bug #925776
15:45 pinesol_green Launchpad bug 925776 in Evergreen 2.4 "located URIs appear in staff client OPAC searches regardless of $9's" (affected: 3, heat: 18) [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/925776
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16:24 kmlussier Oh that's just sad. I apparently created the circulating_items.txt doc that dbs pointed me to earlier today to show how to format links properly. I apparently had no trouble figuring this out on my own 2 years ago.
16:26 * gmcharlt outsources his memory to version control systems, email archives, and wikis for exactly that reason
16:27 * Dyrcona was about to compare it to running git blame on some code and finding your name on the buggy lines.
16:27 * bshum hates that feeling
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17:08 bshum Sigh. So, migrating our old logs to the new log database hasn't been easy. Just hit a new stumbler today where we filled the gap of logs with info from our clients but they weren't updated to the right format.
17:09 bshum So they don't match the channellogger format and those lines reject the matching parser I've been toying with.  Now to learn what other formats and styles were used.
17:09 * bshum ponders more later
17:11 Dyrcona bshum: You want some help with that?
17:13 Dyrcona I have some experience using xslt munging IRC logs from XML to plain text.
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22:24 dbs @later tell berick thinking that rather than the hardcoded "service" string in OpenSRF/Server.pm line 166 for the max_children warning message, we should just embed $self->{service} and identify it clearly
22:24 pinesol_green dbs: The operation succeeded.
23:37 dbs @later tell berick I think I concur with the s/next/return/ in the eval block; simpler valid solution to the problem.
23:37 pinesol_green dbs: The operation succeeded.

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